• 288
##### The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« on: February 09, 2018, 11:00:56 PM »
As someone with basic knowledge in physics and maths, I didn't really understand the part where you talked about the coordinate system.
My knowledge is that you can choose ANY axis as x,y, or z, it really won't affect one's observation.
So, if the take the axis that this force (which funtions analogous to gravity), occurs in the z-axis (or x or y, doesn't really matter), then the other two axis are independent of whatever goes in the z-axis. Therefore, the air can still leak out.
Also, how exactly are they shielded?

Trolltrolls makes a good point.

The thread in "Planes running into the earth" in FE Q&A made me wonder something... The ice wall must be extremely tall, as we have observed that air exists (although sparsely ~5000 Pa) at a rather uniform density at high altitudes (20+ km). Otherwise, since UA (and gravity for that matter) exerts a compressive force on the air, which would leak out from the sides of the FE very quickly (try discharging even low pressure air into a vacuum -- it goes very fast).

The question is, if the ice wall is 20 km tall, and we live on a flat Earth, then surely we should be able to see it with telescopes, no? Also no materials known to man can build a structure 20 km tall, unless you just pile things in a mountain, in which case the base would be prohibitively large (just see how big the base of Mount Everest is, and I believe the base area is exponential to the height). That's a lot of ice.

#### douglips

• 459
##### Re: The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2018, 06:12:55 AM »
Why would the base be exponential to the height? Why not linear?

By way of comparison, Olympus Mons is 20 km tall, and I think about 500 km across.

• 49
##### Re: The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« Reply #2 on: February 10, 2018, 12:15:59 PM »
First off, what is the evidence that the ice wall exists? I think we should start from there. We can by that evidence infer or discover how tall it is and how wide the base is.

What is the evidence that the ice wall exists?

And while we are at that, what is the evidence of the dome? Does the dome start at the ice wall, after the ice wall, on the ice wall, is a part of the ice wall?
« Last Edit: February 10, 2018, 12:42:10 PM by SpaceCadet »

#### Trolltrolls

• 41
##### Re: The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« Reply #3 on: February 10, 2018, 05:38:58 PM »
First off, what is the evidence that the ice wall exists? I think we should start from there. We can by that evidence infer or discover how tall it is and how wide the base is.

What is the evidence that the ice wall exists?

And while we are at that, what is the evidence of the dome? Does the dome start at the ice wall, after the ice wall, on the ice wall, is a part of the ice wall?
I think he's going for proof by contradiction.

• 288
##### Re: The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« Reply #4 on: February 10, 2018, 07:41:13 PM »
Why would the base be exponential to the height? Why not linear?

By way of comparison, Olympus Mons is 20 km tall, and I think about 500 km across.

I'm not an expert in civil engineering, but I believe it's exponential because the parts on the bottom effectively need to support the entire building above; however, for solid structures I may be wrong.

Mars gravity is also 38% of that on Earth. The ice wall would have to be at least 1000 km thick. That's a tremendous amount of ice. Additionally, I'm fairly sure the pressures inside the wall would result in exotic new forms of water.

#### douglips

• 459
##### Re: The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« Reply #5 on: February 11, 2018, 05:19:22 AM »
Why would the base be exponential to the height? Why not linear?

By way of comparison, Olympus Mons is 20 km tall, and I think about 500 km across.

I'm not an expert in civil engineering, but I believe it's exponential because the parts on the bottom effectively need to support the entire building above; however, for solid structures I may be wrong.

Mars gravity is also 38% of that on Earth. The ice wall would have to be at least 1000 km thick. That's a tremendous amount of ice. Additionally, I'm fairly sure the pressures inside the wall would result in exotic new forms of water.

My "why not linear" comment was misguided. What's happening is that you have a classic cube vs. square race going on, as in explanations for why an ant can't be 10 feet tall. You are right that eventually the cube will overtake the square. The question is when?

Mauna Kea exists on earth, and is 10km high. To get to 20km high, the base would have to cover 4x the area, and the mass would be 8x what it is, so it would double the pressure on the earth's surface. Is that too much? If a volcano grew too big would it sink through the crust or would it spread to a larger degree?

• 288
##### Re: The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« Reply #6 on: February 11, 2018, 06:54:24 AM »
Why would the base be exponential to the height? Why not linear?

By way of comparison, Olympus Mons is 20 km tall, and I think about 500 km across.

I'm not an expert in civil engineering, but I believe it's exponential because the parts on the bottom effectively need to support the entire building above; however, for solid structures I may be wrong.

Mars gravity is also 38% of that on Earth. The ice wall would have to be at least 1000 km thick. That's a tremendous amount of ice. Additionally, I'm fairly sure the pressures inside the wall would result in exotic new forms of water.

My "why not linear" comment was misguided. What's happening is that you have a classic cube vs. square race going on, as in explanations for why an ant can't be 10 feet tall. You are right that eventually the cube will overtake the square. The question is when?

Mauna Kea exists on earth, and is 10km high. To get to 20km high, the base would have to cover 4x the area, and the mass would be 8x what it is, so it would double the pressure on the earth's surface. Is that too much? If a volcano grew too big would it sink through the crust or would it spread to a larger degree?

It would spread out over the crust, since rock is rather hard to compress (because Earth is spherical, it has nowhere better to go). Your comments have actually made me think of an even more fatal flaw in the Flat Earth hypothesis; because of the compressive forces involved, Earth should be thicker in the middle and thinner on the outside.

The real problem is that on a Flat Earth, one should very reasonably be able to see these structures, as well as measure the altitude changes near the edge.

#### Scroogie

• 120
##### Re: The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« Reply #7 on: February 13, 2018, 03:13:18 AM »
While we're talking about the ice wall it occurs to me that flerfers should be very much concerned about Global Warming. It has been shown that glaciers the world over are receding, as are the polar ice caps.  Given that the "ice wall" is composed of, well, ice, shouldn't global warming affect this hitherto unobserved structure to the same extent that it does other masses of ice? It I were a flerfer I should be quite concerned as, if the wall is diminished sufficiently we are, apparently, about to lose our atmosphere, followed by our oceans.

Why have I encountered no discussion on this topic on these Forums? Do flerfers consider Global Warming to be, as they do so many other phenomena, a hoax?

#### ShowmetheProof

• 90
• We are fellow scientists, and should act as such.
##### Re: The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« Reply #8 on: February 13, 2018, 04:16:18 PM »
In some theories such as the Celestial Ocean Theory, I believe(Whoever created the theory, correct me if I'm wrong) the Ice Wall is made of the same material as planets, moons, and Libyan Desert Glass.  In the other ones, I would guess that either
A) The Ice Wall is either tall enough or thick enough so that it wouldn't melt
or......
B) Global Warming is a hoax.
I seriously hope that I forgot about another possible answer that would keep the wall from melting, because these are both ridiculous ideas.  Cartoon Characters could think of smarter theories.

#### totallackey

• 529
##### Re: The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« Reply #9 on: February 13, 2018, 04:17:56 PM »
As someone with basic knowledge in physics and maths, I didn't really understand the part where you talked about the coordinate system.
My knowledge is that you can choose ANY axis as x,y, or z, it really won't affect one's observation.
So, if the take the axis that this force (which funtions analogous to gravity), occurs in the z-axis (or x or y, doesn't really matter), then the other two axis are independent of whatever goes in the z-axis. Therefore, the air can still leak out.
Also, how exactly are they shielded?

Trolltrolls makes a good point.

The thread in "Planes running into the earth" in FE Q&A made me wonder something... The ice wall must be extremely tall, as we have observed that air exists (although sparsely ~5000 Pa) at a rather uniform density at high altitudes (20+ km). Otherwise, since UA (and gravity for that matter) exerts a compressive force on the air, which would leak out from the sides of the FE very quickly (try discharging even low pressure air into a vacuum -- it goes very fast).

The question is, if the ice wall is 20 km tall, and we live on a flat Earth, then surely we should be able to see it with telescopes, no? Also no materials known to man can build a structure 20 km tall, unless you just pile things in a mountain, in which case the base would be prohibitively large (just see how big the base of Mount Everest is, and I believe the base area is exponential to the height). That's a lot of ice.
Where do you come up with these outlandish figures?

#### totallackey

• 529
##### Re: The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« Reply #10 on: February 13, 2018, 05:26:06 PM »
While we're talking about the ice wall it occurs to me that flerfers should be very much concerned about Global Warming. It has been shown that glaciers the world over are receding, as are the polar ice caps.  Given that the "ice wall" is composed of, well, ice, shouldn't global warming affect this hitherto unobserved structure to the same extent that it does other masses of ice? It I were a flerfer I should be quite concerned as, if the wall is diminished sufficiently we are, apparently, about to lose our atmosphere, followed by our oceans.

Why have I encountered no discussion on this topic on these Forums? Do flerfers consider Global Warming to be, as they do so many other phenomena, a hoax?
Actually, the same people promoting global warming are telling us to rest assured, confident the ice sheet in Antarctica is slowly growing...

#### Scroogie

• 120
##### Re: The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« Reply #11 on: February 13, 2018, 11:12:34 PM »
While we're talking about the ice wall it occurs to me that flerfers should be very much concerned about Global Warming. It has been shown that glaciers the world over are receding, as are the polar ice caps.  Given that the "ice wall" is composed of, well, ice, shouldn't global warming affect this hitherto unobserved structure to the same extent that it does other masses of ice? It I were a flerfer I should be quite concerned as, if the wall is diminished sufficiently we are, apparently, about to lose our atmosphere, followed by our oceans.

Why have I encountered no discussion on this topic on these Forums? Do flerfers consider Global Warming to be, as they do so many other phenomena, a hoax?
Actually, the same people promoting global warming are telling us to rest assured, confident the ice sheet in Antarctica is slowly growing...

Oh Please, PLEASE direct me to your source for that information. I would find it ever so comforting.

#### totallackey

• 529
##### Re: The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« Reply #12 on: February 14, 2018, 11:58:28 AM »
While we're talking about the ice wall it occurs to me that flerfers should be very much concerned about Global Warming. It has been shown that glaciers the world over are receding, as are the polar ice caps.  Given that the "ice wall" is composed of, well, ice, shouldn't global warming affect this hitherto unobserved structure to the same extent that it does other masses of ice? It I were a flerfer I should be quite concerned as, if the wall is diminished sufficiently we are, apparently, about to lose our atmosphere, followed by our oceans.

Why have I encountered no discussion on this topic on these Forums? Do flerfers consider Global Warming to be, as they do so many other phenomena, a hoax?
Actually, the same people promoting global warming are telling us to rest assured, confident the ice sheet in Antarctica is slowly growing...

Oh Please, PLEASE direct me to your source for that information. I would find it ever so comforting.

Not only that, but wait for it...:

People who continue to subscribe to the science promoting AGW or ACC are in fact helping to promote carbon taxes and have ZERO evidence the proposed solutions will work.

This type of behavior is all based on Malthusian economics and is anti - human.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2018, 04:21:39 PM by totallackey »

#### junker

• Planar Moderator
• 7639
• Boom
##### Re: The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« Reply #13 on: February 14, 2018, 03:11:19 PM »

Not only that, but wait for it...:

RE-tards...I wish you guys would have been around when I was selling cars...

I would be on my yacht in Tahiti right now...LMMFAO!!!

You call FE the snake oil salesman...

You just want to promote carbon-based taxes...

Bunch of Malthusian human hating morans...

You're doing that thing again that landed you a ban last time around. Lay off personal attacks and stick to the arguments, please.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2018, 07:06:32 PM by junker »
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#### totallackey

• 529
##### Re: The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« Reply #14 on: February 14, 2018, 04:17:42 PM »
You're doing that thing again that landed you a ban last time around. Lay off personal attacks and stick to the arguments, please.
You are correct.

I apologize.

Allow me to EDIT my entire post.

Is that better?

Nothing personal, just the specific behavior...

• 288
##### Re: The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« Reply #15 on: February 14, 2018, 05:04:29 PM »

#### totallackey

• 529
##### Re: The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« Reply #16 on: February 14, 2018, 05:23:10 PM »
« Last Edit: February 14, 2018, 10:09:27 PM by totallackey »

#### Baby Thork

• 1142
##### Re: The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« Reply #17 on: February 14, 2018, 09:53:48 PM »
The earth is covered by the vault of heaven ... the firmament.

The firmament is defined as a crystalline material that enshrines the earth.

IE it keeps the air in. No need for a huge wall.
We should beat Thork with mops.

#### Scroogie

• 120
##### Re: The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« Reply #18 on: February 14, 2018, 10:53:55 PM »
While we're talking about the ice wall it occurs to me that flerfers should be very much concerned about Global Warming. It has been shown that glaciers the world over are receding, as are the polar ice caps.  Given that the "ice wall" is composed of, well, ice, shouldn't global warming affect this hitherto unobserved structure to the same extent that it does other masses of ice? It I were a flerfer I should be quite concerned as, if the wall is diminished sufficiently we are, apparently, about to lose our atmosphere, followed by our oceans.

Why have I encountered no discussion on this topic on these Forums? Do flerfers consider Global Warming to be, as they do so many other phenomena, a hoax?
Actually, the same people promoting global warming are telling us to rest assured, confident the ice sheet in Antarctica is slowly growing...

Oh Please, PLEASE direct me to your source for that information. I would find it ever so comforting.

Not only that, but wait for it...:

People who continue to subscribe to the science promoting AGW or ACC are in fact helping to promote carbon taxes and have ZERO evidence the proposed solutions will work.

This type of behavior is all based on Malthusian economics and is anti - human.

Well, the first one I looked at was based entirely on NASA satellite data. We have to throw that one out as, as we all know, satellites are impossible.

I'll keep looking...

... a newer study, (2 years after the NASA study)admittedly based on satellite date, with the addition of mathematical models, has reached the opposite conclusion:

https://phys.org/news/2017-05-growth-east-antarctic-ice-sheet.html

... in any event, I would suggest you do further research before dismissing global warming outright. Start here:

https://insideclimatenews.org/news/31052016/why-antarctica-sea-ice-level-growing-while-arctic-glaciers-melts-climate-change-global-warming

Google can find more if you're so inclined.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2018, 11:04:07 PM by Scroogie »

#### Trolltrolls

• 41
##### Re: The Ice Wall Must Be Very Tall
« Reply #19 on: February 15, 2018, 05:05:18 AM »
The earth is covered by the vault of heaven ... the firmament.

The firmament is defined as a crystalline material that enshrines the earth.

IE it keeps the air in. No need for a huge wall.
But heaven only exists in religion. And not all religions. I propose that the Earth stands on an elephant!
Also, no proof, like the ice wall thing.
Also, makes even less sense.