[Rama Set]

Also remember: if 75% of a state is vaccinated with two doses, 75% of people in thr ICU will probably be double vaccinated.  If not more.  Just like if 99% of people who live in Kansas are American, guess what the percentage of Americans will be in the hospital?

Correlation is not causation.

No, vaccines are meant to reduce the risk of hospitalization. Your example implies it staying level.

[Lord Dave]

Also remember: if 75% of a state is vaccinated with two doses, 75% of people in thr ICU will probably be double vaccinated.  If not more.  Just like if 99% of people who live in Kansas are American, guess what the percentage of Americans will be in the hospital?

Correlation is not causation.

No, vaccines are meant to reduce the risk of hospitalization. Your example implies it staying level.

Kinda the point. 
Not stating what they are in the hospital for implies a link that isn't there. 
Example: 100% of all vaccinated, pregnant women, will visit the hospital within 9 months for a major medical procedure. 
The procedure?  Giving birth.

[Tom Bishop]

Vaccinated people in Italy burning their vaccine passports.

https://twitter.com/calvinrobinson/status/1424258413400313856

[Lord Dave]

Vaccinated people in Italy burning their vaccine passports.

https://twitter.com/calvinrobinson/status/1424258413400313856

Nope.
Wow, its amazing how, even on something you'd support, you still find a tweet that's lying.

So that is a protest, in italy.  That's true.
However, they are burning green pieces of paper to protest the vaccine passport requirements.  They aren't doing it in solidarity, nor are they burning anything official.  It's literally just a protest by people who don't want the vaccine passport requirements.  Several countries have similar protests.

Not that they could burn it anyway as its digital.
You can also get a paper document stating you have had a negative test result in the last few days.  Or proof of prior infection.
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/06/world/europe/italy-green-pass-vaccination-covid.html

In any case: If you're gonna post about a protest, please get it right.

[Tom Bishop]

Not that they could burn it anyway as its digital.
You can also get a paper document stating you have had a negative test result in the last few days.  Or proof of prior infection.
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/06/world/europe/italy-green-pass-vaccination-covid.html

It says right in your link that the pass could be physical.

It's possible that they are burning blank pieces of paper, but that is irrelevant to the message. It is irrelevant to the message if someone is burning a fake dollar bill or a real one in a protest, for example.

[Lord Dave]

Not that they could burn it anyway as its digital.
You can also get a paper document stating you have had a negative test result in the last few days.  Or proof of prior infection.
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/06/world/europe/italy-green-pass-vaccination-covid.html

It says right in your link that the pass could be physical.

Yes yes, you can print out a piece of paper.  Still doesn't change the fact that none of them are doing that.  Unless they all decided to print it on green paper.

It's possible that they are burning blank pieces of paper, but that is irrelevant to the message. It is irrelevant to the message if someone is burning a fake dollar bill or a real one in a protest, for example.

Possible?  Yeah.  Yeah it's possible 100% possible.  Do you see anything written on those pieces of paper?  No.

And yes, it is irrelevant to the message.  But what I'm saying is... GET THE MESSAGE RIGHT!

The message is "We protest the government's limitations for unvaccinated people" (which is probably everyone at that protest) not "Vaccinated People burning their passports in solidarity".  One is about supporting other people, the other is about not being restricted themselves. 

Your trash tweet post is twisting their protest into your propoganda.  So why don't you be a decent human, admit you grabbed a tweet without fact checking, and go post a tweet with the proper reason why they're protesting.

[Action80]

So much for the extensive clinical trials you were trying to praise, Rama.

Pure, disgusting crap posted by you once again.

"Even though far from being comprehensive or even adequate, this document has rather far-reaching implications: it shows that Pfizer— as well as the authorities that were apprised of these data— must have recognized the grave risks of adverse events after vaccination even before the onset of clinical trials. Nevertheless, Pfizer’s own clinical trials failed to monitor any of the clinical risks that were clearly evident from these data and the regulatory authorities failed to enforce proper standards of oversight. This dual failure has caused the most grievous harm to the public.
1The same data may also have been filed in the U.S. and other wester countries, but the FDA and the corresponding health regulators did not release them to the public. "

https://drive.google.com/viewerng/viewer?url=http://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net/randyhillier/pages/958/attachments/original/1628198186/Pfizer-pharmacokinetics-and-toxicity.pdf?1628198186

And you called us out for posting documentation on "unofficial sites".  Can't get anymore unofficial than your own google drive. XD

Also: an Ortheopedist and a retired microbiologist probably aren't the best group to be reliable in vaccine results.

I posted a peer reviewed paper, written by two doctors.

The paper reports on the processes utilized in mRNA vaccines and the results of the Pfizer protocols used in the development of the vaccine.

Go lie down in the corner somewhere.

Your writings and musings are useless here.

[Lord Dave]

So much for the extensive clinical trials you were trying to praise, Rama.

Pure, disgusting crap posted by you once again.

"Even though far from being comprehensive or even adequate, this document has rather far-reaching implications: it shows that Pfizer— as well as the authorities that were apprised of these data— must have recognized the grave risks of adverse events after vaccination even before the onset of clinical trials. Nevertheless, Pfizer’s own clinical trials failed to monitor any of the clinical risks that were clearly evident from these data and the regulatory authorities failed to enforce proper standards of oversight. This dual failure has caused the most grievous harm to the public.
1The same data may also have been filed in the U.S. and other wester countries, but the FDA and the corresponding health regulators did not release them to the public. "

https://drive.google.com/viewerng/viewer?url=http://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net/randyhillier/pages/958/attachments/original/1628198186/Pfizer-pharmacokinetics-and-toxicity.pdf?1628198186

And you called us out for posting documentation on "unofficial sites".  Can't get anymore unofficial than your own google drive. XD

Also: an Ortheopedist and a retired microbiologist probably aren't the best group to be reliable in vaccine results.

I posted a peer reviewed paper, written by two doctors.

Please post the link to the journals it appears it as well as the peer reviews. 
Also, as you'll not note, I didn't attack the validity of their data, just your hypocracy of decrying the link used while using an even less credible link.

The paper reports on the processes utilized in mRNA vaccines and the results of the Pfizer protocols used in the development of the vaccine.

Allegedly.  Gonna wait for those peer review links there buddy.

Go lie down in the corner somewhere.

Your writings and musings are useless here.

Nah, I have things to do. 

[Action80]

So much for the extensive clinical trials you were trying to praise, Rama.

Pure, disgusting crap posted by you once again.

"Even though far from being comprehensive or even adequate, this document has rather far-reaching implications: it shows that Pfizer— as well as the authorities that were apprised of these data— must have recognized the grave risks of adverse events after vaccination even before the onset of clinical trials. Nevertheless, Pfizer’s own clinical trials failed to monitor any of the clinical risks that were clearly evident from these data and the regulatory authorities failed to enforce proper standards of oversight. This dual failure has caused the most grievous harm to the public.
1The same data may also have been filed in the U.S. and other wester countries, but the FDA and the corresponding health regulators did not release them to the public. "

https://drive.google.com/viewerng/viewer?url=http://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net/randyhillier/pages/958/attachments/original/1628198186/Pfizer-pharmacokinetics-and-toxicity.pdf?1628198186

And you called us out for posting documentation on "unofficial sites".  Can't get anymore unofficial than your own google drive. XD

Also: an Ortheopedist and a retired microbiologist probably aren't the best group to be reliable in vaccine results.

I posted a peer reviewed paper, written by two doctors.

Please post the link to the journals it appears it as well as the peer reviews. 
Also, as you'll not note, I didn't attack the validity of their data, just your hypocracy of decrying the link used while using an even less credible link.

I didn't decry the link to the paper.

Wtf are you writing about.

Google docs is a recognized storage area for documents.

Quit posting your bullshit here.

If you don't have anything contradicting the findings of the paper, then you got shit, which is par for the course coming from you.

The paper reports on the processes utilized in mRNA vaccines and the results of the Pfizer protocols used in the development of the vaccine.

Allegedly.  Gonna wait for those peer review links there buddy.

Nothing alleged about it, it describes the processes in full.

You got shit, once again.

Go lie down in the corner somewhere.

Your writings and musings are useless here.

Nah, I have things to do.

Nothing important obviously.

[Lord Dave]

So much for the extensive clinical trials you were trying to praise, Rama.

Pure, disgusting crap posted by you once again.

"Even though far from being comprehensive or even adequate, this document has rather far-reaching implications: it shows that Pfizer— as well as the authorities that were apprised of these data— must have recognized the grave risks of adverse events after vaccination even before the onset of clinical trials. Nevertheless, Pfizer’s own clinical trials failed to monitor any of the clinical risks that were clearly evident from these data and the regulatory authorities failed to enforce proper standards of oversight. This dual failure has caused the most grievous harm to the public.
1The same data may also have been filed in the U.S. and other wester countries, but the FDA and the corresponding health regulators did not release them to the public. "

https://drive.google.com/viewerng/viewer?url=http://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net/randyhillier/pages/958/attachments/original/1628198186/Pfizer-pharmacokinetics-and-toxicity.pdf?1628198186

And you called us out for posting documentation on "unofficial sites".  Can't get anymore unofficial than your own google drive. XD

Also: an Ortheopedist and a retired microbiologist probably aren't the best group to be reliable in vaccine results.

I posted a peer reviewed paper, written by two doctors.

Please post the link to the journals it appears it as well as the peer reviews. 
Also, as you'll not note, I didn't attack the validity of their data, just your hypocracy of decrying the link used while using an even less credible link.

I didn't decry the link to the paper.

Wtf are you writing about.

Google docs is a recognized storage area for documents.

Quit posting your bullshit here.

If you don't have anything contradicting the findings of the paper, then you got shit, which is par for the course coming from you.

Appologies, I wasn't clear.
I was referring to this:

I doubt the authenticity, considering the link from which it was derived.

To view the actual document, you must pay.

In which you decry the authenticity of a document because the "actual?" document is behind a paywall.  And since anyone can upload anything to google drive... It doesn't lead it to credibility.

As for critquing it.  I haven't had time to read it yet.  And I know you lack the education required to understand if a paper like this was correct or not.  So your opinion or even mine, is irrelevant.

The paper reports on the processes utilized in mRNA vaccines and the results of the Pfizer protocols used in the development of the vaccine.

Allegedly.  Gonna wait for those peer review links there buddy.

Nothing alleged about it, it describes the processes in full.

You got shit, once again.

You claimed it was peer reviewed.  So where did you read it?  What journal?  Or did someone link it on a forum/facebook and you took it as authentic? 

Go lie down in the corner somewhere.

Your writings and musings are useless here.

Nah, I have things to do.

Nothing important obviously.

Important to me.  Not to you, obviously, but to me.

[Action80]

Two doctors wrote the paper.

You posted a court decision that I wasn't able to find.

Hoo fucking ray.

Give yourself a firm pat on the ass and an attaboy for doing one thing right in your life.

[Iceman]

Two doctors wrote the paper.

If you get sick with a respiratory illness that prevents you from breathing and also affects your cognitive abilities, taking away your taste and smell, will you email those two doctors or will you go to an ER?

[Action80]

Two doctors wrote the paper.

If you get sick with a respiratory illness that prevents you from breathing and also affects your cognitive abilities, taking away your taste and smell, will you email those two doctors or will you go to an ER?

How long did it take to formulate the question?

I realize you are part of the crowd wanting me to get sick and die, but I got news for you.

I won't die from covid and I am not going to get the vaccine.

[Lord Dave]

Two doctors wrote the paper.

You posted a court decision that I wasn't able to find.

Hoo fucking ray.

Give yourself a firm pat on the ass and an attaboy for doing one thing right in your life.

Did they?
I'm still waiting for the peer reviewed journal they were in.
Or even how you got the link.
You know... something to substantiate your claim?  Because right now I have no evidence you didn't just write it yourself and put their names on it.  And since I can't see the owner of the google drive, it could very well be yours.

So put up or shut up because if I have to do it for you... well... that's just embarassing.

[Roundy]

Two doctors wrote the paper.

If you get sick with a respiratory illness that prevents you from breathing and also affects your cognitive abilities, taking away your taste and smell, will you email those two doctors or will you go to an ER?

How long did it take to formulate the question?

I realize you are part of the crowd wanting me to get sick and die, but I got news for you.

I won't die from covid and I am not going to get the vaccine.

I would never wish death on another human being. I do, however, hope that enough restrictions get put in place that you feel it. That's all I care about, that you suffer for making the world a worse place, is it really too much to ask?

[Lord Dave]

Two doctors wrote the paper.

If you get sick with a respiratory illness that prevents you from breathing and also affects your cognitive abilities, taking away your taste and smell, will you email those two doctors or will you go to an ER?

How long did it take to formulate the question?

I realize you are part of the crowd wanting me to get sick and die, but I got news for you.

I won't die from covid and I am not going to get the vaccine.

I would never wish death on another human being. I do, however, hope that enough restrictions get put in place that you feel it. That's all I care about, that you suffer for making the world a worse place, is it really too much to ask?

Well, he lives in Chicago... Soooo pretty sure he's suffering already.

[AATW]

Two doctors wrote the paper.

I'll just leave this here

https://www.ama-assn.org/press-center/press-releases/ama-survey-shows-over-96-doctors-fully-vaccinated-against-covid-19

[Lord Dave]

 Oh hey look.... Exactly what we said would happen when dumbasses open up too soon.

https://www.npr.org/2021/08/12/1027103023/florida-mississippi-arkansas-hospitals-overwhelmed-covid-19-delta?sc=18&f=1001

[WTF_Seriously]

Oh hey look.... Exactly what we said would happen when dumbasses open up too soon.

https://www.npr.org/2021/08/12/1027103023/florida-mississippi-arkansas-hospitals-overwhelmed-covid-19-delta?sc=18&f=1001

And the people complaining loudest about reimposing restrictions are the ones directly responsible for reimposing restictions.  American's are fucking arrogant idiots.

[existoid]

This is worth a read:
https://greenwald.substack.com/p/the-bizarre-refusal-to-apply-cost

His ultimate point can be succinctly stated:
Let's use our normal cost-benefit analysis that we (should) apply to virtually all public policy debates to the various debates regarding Covid (vaccines, lockdowns, etc.).