Offline Blanko

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #260 on: March 30, 2014, 05:01:17 PM »
It does have puzzles and it has more of them than SotC, but I guess you wouldn't know.

Puzzles and getting puzzled are not the same thing.

I agree. However, Dark Souls does have more puzzle-like elements than SotC, and it requires the player to think about their strategies far more. SotC is an extremely straightforward game, with the only think requiring any presence of mind being figuring out the small, easy gimmick at the start of each fight, after which the only thing you need to care about is moving left stick until you find the obvious weak spot which is conveniently marked for you. SotC might be a fun experiment thematically, but in execution it is just poor. There's no movesets you need to learn, no effective combos to find out, no attack windows, and you don't need to worry about positioning because no boss ever poses a real threat. All of which makes Dark Souls require more thought and strategy than SotC, but I guess you wouldn't know.

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Offline Rushy

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #261 on: March 30, 2014, 05:05:54 PM »
I agree. However, Dark Souls does have more puzzle-like elements than SotC, and it requires the player to think about their strategies far more. SotC is an extremely straightforward game, with the only think requiring any presence of mind being figuring out the small, easy gimmick at the start of each fight, after which the only thing you need to care about is moving left stick until you find the obvious weak spot which is conveniently marked for you. SotC might be a fun experiment thematically, but in execution it is just poor. There's no movesets you need to learn, no effective combos to find out, no attack windows, and you don't need to worry about positioning because no boss ever poses a real threat. All of which makes Dark Souls require more thought and strategy than SotC, but I guess you wouldn't know.

Both SotC and Darks Souls are simplistic, yes, but you seem to forget that SotC did that on purpose and Dark Souls tries to be complex but remains to be wanting.

Offline Blanko

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #262 on: March 30, 2014, 05:10:31 PM »
I agree. However, Dark Souls does have more puzzle-like elements than SotC, and it requires the player to think about their strategies far more. SotC is an extremely straightforward game, with the only think requiring any presence of mind being figuring out the small, easy gimmick at the start of each fight, after which the only thing you need to care about is moving left stick until you find the obvious weak spot which is conveniently marked for you. SotC might be a fun experiment thematically, but in execution it is just poor. There's no movesets you need to learn, no effective combos to find out, no attack windows, and you don't need to worry about positioning because no boss ever poses a real threat. All of which makes Dark Souls require more thought and strategy than SotC, but I guess you wouldn't know.

Both SotC and Darks Souls are simplistic, yes, but you seem to forget that SotC did that on purpose and Dark Souls tries to be complex but remains to be wanting.

SotC is a poorly designed game on purpose? Okay, I don't know why that would make a difference. Dark Souls is still a lot more complex than SotC, but I guess you wouldn't know.

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Offline Rushy

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #263 on: March 30, 2014, 05:20:12 PM »
SotC is a poorly designed game on purpose?

What makes you think that? Simplicity by design is good design. Simplicity by fuck up is not.

Okay, I don't know why that would make a difference. Dark Souls is still a lot more complex than SotC, but I guess you wouldn't know.

It isn't more complex than SotC, but it really tries to be. That's what makes its poor design shine like a star.

Offline Blanko

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #264 on: March 30, 2014, 05:22:46 PM »
SotC is a poorly designed game on purpose?

What makes you think that? Simplicity by design is good design. Simplicity by fuck up is not.

SotC isn't poorly designed because it's simple, it's poorly designed because its simple mechanics aren't good.

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Okay, I don't know why that would make a difference. Dark Souls is still a lot more complex than SotC, but I guess you wouldn't know.

It isn't more complex than SotC, but it really tries to be. That's what makes its poor design shine like a star.

But of course, you wouldn't know that.

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Offline Pete Svarrior

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #265 on: March 30, 2014, 05:58:14 PM »
But of course, you wouldn't know that.
Why wouldn't he?
Read the FAQ before asking your question - chances are we already addressed it.
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Offline Rushy

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #266 on: March 30, 2014, 06:01:55 PM »
SotC isn't poorly designed because it's simple, it's poorly designed because its simple mechanics aren't good.

SotC is exactly what its developers wanted it to be. I can't say the same for Dark Souls.

But of course, you wouldn't know that.

A poor attempt to avoid the point. Reply again or assume defeat.

Offline Blanko

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #267 on: March 30, 2014, 06:16:16 PM »
SotC isn't poorly designed because it's simple, it's poorly designed because its simple mechanics aren't good.

SotC is exactly what its developers wanted it to be. I can't say the same for Dark Souls.

I'm pretty sure they didn't want it to be a poorly designed game.

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But of course, you wouldn't know that.

A poor attempt to avoid the point. Reply again or assume defeat.

The point? You mean, the claim? Demonstrate how Dark Souls isn't more complex than SotC or assume defeat. You're basing everything on what you've seen in a speedrun, not how the game actually is.

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Offline Rushy

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #268 on: March 30, 2014, 06:36:19 PM »
I'm pretty sure they didn't want it to be a poorly designed game.

Correct.

The point? You mean, the claim? Demonstrate how Dark Souls isn't more complex than SotC or assume defeat. You're basing everything on what you've seen in a speedrun, not how the game actually is.

We've already been over this. You admitted Dark Souls is just dodging/swiping.

Offline Blanko

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #269 on: March 30, 2014, 06:42:22 PM »
Correct.

Well, then the game isn't exactly how they wanted it to be.



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We've already been over this. You admitted Dark Souls is just dodging/swiping.

No I didn't.

Just like how to an outside observer [...] Dark Souls is, er, I guess rolling and swiping.

I'm not an outside observer, you are.

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Offline Rushy

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #270 on: March 30, 2014, 07:00:37 PM »
Well, then the game isn't exactly how they wanted it to be.

I'm glad we agree, then. Dark Souls is poorly designed because they developers wanted a complex game, but made a simplistic one. Simplicity in and of itself is not poor design.

No I didn't.

You said earlier that dodging and swiping is a generalization of Dark Souls, are you taking that back?

I'm not an outside observer, you are.

Which is irrelevant. You keep bringing this up, I can only assume it's because you don't have any better arguments to make. How droll.

Offline Blanko

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #271 on: March 30, 2014, 07:18:43 PM »
Well, then the game isn't exactly how they wanted it to be.

I'm glad we agree, then. Dark Souls is poorly designed because they developers wanted a complex game, but made a simplistic one. Simplicity in and of itself is not poor design.

It's funny because I was talking about SotC and you're talking about Dark Souls, he he he

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No I didn't.

You said earlier that dodging and swiping is a generalization of Dark Souls, are you taking that back?

I guess generalization isn't the best word for it. Call it an oversimplification, then. Point being, there's a lot more to the game mechanics than "dodging and swiping", even in playstyles that utilize those two things. I've already listed a few earlier, which you didn't address.

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I'm not an outside observer, you are.

Which is irrelevant. You keep bringing this up, I can only assume it's because you don't have any better arguments to make. How droll.

I keep bringing it up because you don't seem to realize that you don't have the necessary knowledge to support your own arguments.

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Offline Pete Svarrior

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #272 on: March 30, 2014, 07:25:42 PM »
Why is this thread?
Read the FAQ before asking your question - chances are we already addressed it.
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Offline Blanko

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #273 on: March 30, 2014, 07:35:00 PM »
Why is this thread?

Because nobody is actually playing either of the two Dark Souls games other than me and Saddam so I guess I might as well feed Rushy

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Offline Pete Svarrior

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #274 on: March 30, 2014, 07:46:31 PM »
Because nobody is actually playing either of the two Dark Souls games other than me and Saddam
ehehehehe is it because drak solls is such a terrible gaem?
Read the FAQ before asking your question - chances are we already addressed it.
Follow the Flat Earth Society on Twitter and Facebook!

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Offline Blanko

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #275 on: March 30, 2014, 07:48:40 PM »
Because nobody is actually playing either of the two Dark Souls games other than me and Saddam
ehehehehe is it because drak solls is such a terrible gaem?

No, everyone else is a filthy casual and massive pleb

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Offline Rushy

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #276 on: March 30, 2014, 08:41:51 PM »
It's funny because I was talking about SotC and you're talking about Dark Souls, he he he

The difference being SotC was designed to be simple. Dark Souls tried to be complex, and failed miserably. Simplicity by design: good. Simplicity by fuck up: bad. I feel like I'm repeating myself because you have such poor reading comprehension.

I guess generalization isn't the best word for it. Call it an oversimplification, then. Point being, there's a lot more to the game mechanics than "dodging and swiping", even in playstyles that utilize those two things. I've already listed a few earlier, which you didn't address.

Those game mechanics are poorly implemented, in such a way that they are wholly unnecessary.

I keep bringing it up because you don't seem to realize that you don't have the necessary knowledge to support your own arguments.

In that case it should be rather easy to argue against all my points. Instead, you dodge them repeatedly. Quite the paradoxical situation.

No, everyone else is a filthy casual and massive pleb

Dark Souls is targeted towards casual gamers.
« Last Edit: March 30, 2014, 08:43:22 PM by Irushwithscvs »

Offline Blanko

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #277 on: March 30, 2014, 08:52:31 PM »
It's funny because I was talking about SotC and you're talking about Dark Souls, he he he

The difference being SotC was designed to be simple. Dark Souls tried to be complex, and failed miserably. Simplicity by design: good. Simplicity by fuck up: bad. I feel like I'm repeating myself because you have such poor reading comprehension.

Or maybe you do, since I've already addressed this.

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I guess generalization isn't the best word for it. Call it an oversimplification, then. Point being, there's a lot more to the game mechanics than "dodging and swiping", even in playstyles that utilize those two things. I've already listed a few earlier, which you didn't address.

Those game mechanics are poorly implemented, in such a way that they are wholly unnecessary.

Incorrect, but of course you wouldn't know that.

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I keep bringing it up because you don't seem to realize that you don't have the necessary knowledge to support your own arguments.

In that case it should be rather easy to argue against all my points. Instead, you dodge them repeatedly. Quite the paradoxical situation.

Of course it's easy, that's why I keep bringing up that you don't know shit. You don't have a leg to stand on, and all I have to do to counter your points is to demonstrate that.

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No, everyone else is a filthy casual and massive pleb

Dark Souls is targeted towards casual gamers.

Irrelevant.

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Offline beardo

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #278 on: March 30, 2014, 09:09:32 PM »
bitches, pleeeeeease
The Mastery.

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Offline Rushy

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Re: Dark Souls
« Reply #279 on: March 30, 2014, 09:11:35 PM »
Or maybe you do, since I've already addressed this.

You don't seem to understand the difference between simplicity by design and simplicity by accident. One is good, the other, not so much. This is why SotC has good design while Dark Souls does not.

Incorrect, but of course you wouldn't know that.

You know what really is hilarious, I, ah well I won't spoil it.

Of course it's easy, that's why I keep bringing up that you don't know shit. You don't have a leg to stand on, and all I have to do to counter your points is to demonstrate that.

It's so easy you're not making a point? You're making a point about making a point, but you seem to have forgotten the actual point. All you seem to be full of is excuses. This is exactly how the last argument degenerated, you can't admit that Dark Souls really is poorly designed. It's not even that great of a game, it's amazing your so glued to its ass.

Irrelevant.

Filthy casual.

bitches, pleeeeeease
Disregard Beardo, acquire Blanko tears.