Poll

What is happening / did happen on Monday August 21 2017?

One of the PLANETS (name which one) passes in front of the sun
0 (0%)
Something happens to the sun itself (provide details)
0 (0%)
Other (expand on that)
0 (0%)
Atmospheric phenomenon (provide details)
1 (8.3%)
The SHADOW OBJECT (explicitly NOT the moon) passes in front of the sun
2 (16.7%)
The MOON passes in front of the sun
9 (75%)

Total Members Voted: 10

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Offline Rounder

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I am curious if there are any Flat Earth folks who believe that Monday's eclipse will be caused by something other than "the Moon is going to be between earth and sun".  There is nothing in the Wiki about solar eclipse, as far as I can find.

I also wonder if an FE who acknowledges that a solar eclipse means "moon in front of sun" would be willing to work out some geometry that creates the ground track matching the observed ground track.
Proud member of İntikam's "Ignore List"
Ok. You proven you are unworthy to unignored. You proven it was a bad idea to unignore you. and it was for me a disgusting experience...Now you are going to place where you deserved and accustomed.
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You accuse {FE} people of malice where incompetence suffice

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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: Are there any FE who think it's NOT the moon causing the eclipse?
« Reply #1 on: August 20, 2017, 01:09:31 AM »
There is nothing in the Wiki about solar eclipse, as far as I can find.

Did you try searching?

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Offline Rounder

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Re: Are there any FE who think it's NOT the moon causing the eclipse?
« Reply #2 on: August 20, 2017, 08:43:05 AM »
There is nothing in the Wiki about solar eclipse, as far as I can find.

Did you try searching?
Gee, Tom, thanks so much!  Yes, I tried searching.  That's why the sentence reads "as far as I can FIND" instead of "as far as I KNOW"
For example, I searched for "solar eclipse" and got two results for LUNAR eclipse.
I searched the word "solar" by itself and got 6 results, none of them about solar eclipses.
I searched the word "eclipse" by itself and got a dozen results, again all for LUNAR eclipse results.

Tell you what: if it's in there somewhere, and if you know it's there, you could help a guy out and tell me where it is.
Proud member of İntikam's "Ignore List"
Ok. You proven you are unworthy to unignored. You proven it was a bad idea to unignore you. and it was for me a disgusting experience...Now you are going to place where you deserved and accustomed.
Quote from: SexWarrior
You accuse {FE} people of malice where incompetence suffice

Offline StinkyOne

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Re: Are there any FE who think it's NOT the moon causing the eclipse?
« Reply #3 on: August 20, 2017, 10:19:51 PM »
I also searched the wiki and got the same results. All lunar. The FEers probably won't touch this one with any real comments. A shadow object??? LOL, they just keep making stuff up so they don't have to admit their pet theory is wrong.

Question for those that think this shadow object is real - has it ever been observed blocking out any star light or the planets?
I saw a video where a pilot was flying above the sun.
-Terry50

geckothegeek

Re: Are there any FE who think it's NOT the moon causing the eclipse?
« Reply #4 on: August 20, 2017, 11:39:59 PM »
There is nothing in the Wiki about solar eclipse, as far as I can find.

Did you try searching?
Gee, Tom, thanks so much!  Yes, I tried searching.  That's why the sentence reads "as far as I can FIND" instead of "as far as I KNOW"
For example, I searched for "solar eclipse" and got two results for LUNAR eclipse.
I searched the word "solar" by itself and got 6 results, none of them about solar eclipses.
I searched the word "eclipse" by itself and got a dozen results, again all for LUNAR eclipse results.

Tell you what: if it's in there somewhere, and if you know it's there, you could help a guy out and tell me where it is.

Rounder-
 I tried the same way you did and got the same results....or lack of them.
Make that two persons that need some help.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2017, 11:43:10 PM by geckothegeek »

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Offline TomInAustin

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Re: Are there any FE who think it's NOT the moon causing the eclipse?
« Reply #5 on: August 21, 2017, 02:21:19 PM »
There is nothing in the Wiki about solar eclipse, as far as I can find.

Did you try searching?
Gee, Tom, thanks so much!  Yes, I tried searching.  That's why the sentence reads "as far as I can FIND" instead of "as far as I KNOW"
For example, I searched for "solar eclipse" and got two results for LUNAR eclipse.
I searched the word "solar" by itself and got 6 results, none of them about solar eclipses.
I searched the word "eclipse" by itself and got a dozen results, again all for LUNAR eclipse results.

Tell you what: if it's in there somewhere, and if you know it's there, you could help a guy out and tell me where it is.

Rounder-
 I tried the same way you did and got the same results....or lack of them.
Make that two persons that need some help.

Yet another hole in Tom's thinking, that the FAQ/Wike has all the answers.  No mention of Solar Eclipse.

Do you have a citation for this sweeping generalisation?

Re: Are there any FE who think it's NOT the moon causing the eclipse?
« Reply #6 on: August 21, 2017, 09:37:31 PM »
I found these two quotes in Chapter 11 of Earth, Not a Globe
Quote from: Samuel Birley Rowbotham
"A solar eclipse is the result simply of the moon passing between the sun and the observer on earth."
Quote from: Samuel Birley Rowbotham
As a solar eclipse occurs from the moon passing before the sun, so, from the evidence above collected, it is evident that a lunar eclipse arises from a similar cause...
This chapter is titled CAUSE OF SOLAR AND LUNAR ECLIPSES.  These quotes constitute the only explanation for a solar eclipse.  The entire chapter is actually about lunar eclipses.

I believe the answer to your question is: No to other eclipse causes. FE's believe that the solar eclipse is caused by the moon passing in front of the sun.
The hallmark of true science is repeatability to the point of accurate prediction.

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Offline TomInAustin

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Re: Are there any FE who think it's NOT the moon causing the eclipse?
« Reply #7 on: August 22, 2017, 12:35:45 AM »
I found these two quotes in Chapter 11 of Earth, Not a Globe
Quote from: Samuel Birley Rowbotham
"A solar eclipse is the result simply of the moon passing between the sun and the observer on earth."
Quote from: Samuel Birley Rowbotham
As a solar eclipse occurs from the moon passing before the sun, so, from the evidence above collected, it is evident that a lunar eclipse arises from a similar cause...
This chapter is titled CAUSE OF SOLAR AND LUNAR ECLIPSES.  These quotes constitute the only explanation for a solar eclipse.  The entire chapter is actually about lunar eclipses.

I believe the answer to your question is: No to other eclipse causes. FE's believe that the solar eclipse is caused by the moon passing in front of the sun.

Which of course would not be possible with an object only 3000 miles away.
Do you have a citation for this sweeping generalisation?

geckothegeek

Re: Are there any FE who think it's NOT the moon causing the eclipse?
« Reply #8 on: August 22, 2017, 12:47:27 AM »
I found these two quotes in Chapter 11 of Earth, Not a Globe
Quote from: Samuel Birley Rowbotham
"A solar eclipse is the result simply of the moon passing between the sun and the observer on earth."
Quote from: Samuel Birley Rowbotham
As a solar eclipse occurs from the moon passing before the sun, so, from the evidence above collected, it is evident that a lunar eclipse arises from a similar cause...
This chapter is titled CAUSE OF SOLAR AND LUNAR ECLIPSES.  These quotes constitute the only explanation for a solar eclipse.  The entire chapter is actually about lunar eclipses.

I believe the answer to your question is: No to other eclipse causes. FE's believe that the solar eclipse is caused by the moon passing in front of the sun.

Which of course would not be possible with an object only 3000 miles away.

And in the same orbit and the same distance from the earth.

Re: Are there any FE who think it's NOT the moon causing the eclipse?
« Reply #9 on: August 22, 2017, 02:00:41 AM »
Which of course would not be possible with an object only 3000 miles away.

Well now hold on.  The FE community doesn't even know the distance from New York to Paris because water gets in the way of wheeled measurements.
I don't expect them to actually know, with any competence, the distance to the moon.
The hallmark of true science is repeatability to the point of accurate prediction.

Re: Are there any FE who think it's NOT the moon causing the eclipse?
« Reply #10 on: August 22, 2017, 02:51:41 PM »
I have a related question about the motion of the moon in the FE model.

I understand that this diagram is a simplification to show how the Sun works and is not intended to show the movement of the moon.


In this wiki article,  https://wiki.tfes.org/The_Phases_of_the_Moon
it is explained that the Sun and moon wobble up and down to produce the moon phasing.

Additionally, the moon can't be on the opposite side from the Sun all the time, because then a solar eclipse could never happen like we saw yesterday.

Is there a more detailed explanation, diagram, or animation that shows how the moon is actually proposed to move in the FE model?
The hallmark of true science is repeatability to the point of accurate prediction.

Offline StinkyOne

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Re: Are there any FE who think it's NOT the moon causing the eclipse?
« Reply #11 on: August 22, 2017, 03:36:01 PM »
I have a related question about the motion of the moon in the FE model.

I understand that this diagram is a simplification to show how the Sun works and is not intended to show the movement of the moon.


In this wiki article,  https://wiki.tfes.org/The_Phases_of_the_Moon
it is explained that the Sun and moon wobble up and down to produce the moon phasing.

Additionally, the moon can't be on the opposite side from the Sun all the time, because then a solar eclipse could never happen like we saw yesterday.

Is there a more detailed explanation, diagram, or animation that shows how the moon is actually proposed to move in the FE model?

I have come up with a completely valid theory for the way the moon and Sun orbit one another in FET. I call "Momentum Altering Gravitationally Induced Cycle", or MAGIC.
I saw a video where a pilot was flying above the sun.
-Terry50

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Offline TomInAustin

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Re: Are there any FE who think it's NOT the moon causing the eclipse?
« Reply #12 on: August 22, 2017, 07:08:00 PM »
I have a related question about the motion of the moon in the FE model.

I understand that this diagram is a simplification to show how the Sun works and is not intended to show the movement of the moon.


In this wiki article,  https://wiki.tfes.org/The_Phases_of_the_Moon
it is explained that the Sun and moon wobble up and down to produce the moon phasing.

Additionally, the moon can't be on the opposite side from the Sun all the time, because then a solar eclipse could never happen like we saw yesterday.

Is there a more detailed explanation, diagram, or animation that shows how the moon is actually proposed to move in the FE model?

I think you know the answer to that question.  FE claims there is no real FE map, and that diagrams in the Wiki are just examples.  What I wonder is how is the Wiki the end all when people say to read it, but when you quote it you are told that it's only for examples.   
Do you have a citation for this sweeping generalisation?

Re: Are there any FE who think it's NOT the moon causing the eclipse?
« Reply #13 on: August 23, 2017, 05:21:34 AM »
I think you know the answer to that question.  FE claims there is no real FE map, and that diagrams in the Wiki are just examples.  What I wonder is how is the Wiki the end all when people say to read it, but when you quote it you are told that it's only for examples.

I've seen what TomInAustin is talking about happen before on this message board, but am hoping it won't happen this time.  Can someone point me to a more detailed description of the moon's motion relative to the Earth and Sun?  I'd like to see a description, diagram, or animation that shows how the moon cycles through its phases and how it periodically ends up on the same side as the sun to enable a solar eclipse.
The hallmark of true science is repeatability to the point of accurate prediction.

Offline 3DGeek

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Re: Are there any FE who think it's NOT the moon causing the eclipse?
« Reply #14 on: August 23, 2017, 11:03:06 AM »
Yet another hole in Tom's thinking, that the FAQ/Wike has all the answers.  No mention of Solar Eclipse.

The Wiki is FAR from Tom's claimed beliefs.

This makes discussion difficult:

* How does X work? -- Check the Wiki.
* It's not in the Wiki! -- It's in the books we link to.
* Oh - well, I can easily disprove that! -- Tom doesn't believe any of that anyway.
* So how *DOES* X work? -- Check the Wiki.
* OK - so here is a comprehensive proof that ALL of the current FE theories about X are wrong -- Tom says "we don't know about that".
* Here is a proof that NO POSSIBLE FET answer can ever possibly work. -- (silence)
* Q.E.D - the Earth is Round! -- No it's not!

...and so forth...

It is VERY clear that no two FE'ers have the same beliefs.  There are always at least three contradictory explanations for everything - and Tom jumps between them - in the event that we conclusively prove that he's wrong, we're either ignored or increasingly bizarre "rules of evidence" are demanded.

Fortunately, there simply is no possible way for FET to be correct.  The evidence that it cannot be true is truly overwhelming.

I find it significant that the number of FE'ers posting here has dropped to almost zero in past weeks.  Whether it's because the quality of RE arguments are getting better - or whether Tom's position of authority looks less and less solid - it's hard to tell.  But it's rather clear that this FE group is in trouble.
Hey Tom:  What path do the photons take from the physical location of the sun to my eye at sunset?

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Offline rabinoz

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Re: Are there any FE who think it's NOT the moon causing the eclipse?
« Reply #15 on: August 23, 2017, 11:43:09 AM »
There is nothing in the Wiki about solar eclipse, as far as I can find.

Did you try searching?
Gee, Tom, thanks so much!  Yes, I tried searching.  That's why the sentence reads "as far as I can FIND" instead of "as far as I KNOW"
For example, I searched for "solar eclipse" and got two results for LUNAR eclipse.
I searched the word "solar" by itself and got 6 results, none of them about solar eclipses.
I searched the word "eclipse" by itself and got a dozen results, again all for LUNAR eclipse results.

Tell you what: if it's in there somewhere, and if you know it's there, you could help a guy out and tell me where it is.

Rounder-
 I tried the same way you did and got the same results....or lack of them.
Make that two persons that need some help.

Yet another hole in Tom's thinking, that the FAQ/Wike has all the answers.  No mention of Solar Eclipse.
Now here is an example of the  :D tremendous help  :D is to be in both societies.In the Wiki of the other place, under "The Lunar Eclipse" we find:
Quote
The Lunar Eclipse
A Solar Eclipse occurs when the moon passes in front of the sun.

From: The Flat Earth Society, Lunar Eclipse
Yes, even there the description seems limited to a one-liner under the heading Lunar Eclipse.

Maybe this society just "misplaced" the description of the solar eclipse and we'll find it in a little bottom drawer somewhere.

geckothegeek

Re: Are there any FE who think it's NOT the moon causing the eclipse?
« Reply #16 on: August 23, 2017, 05:11:47 PM »
Maybe this whole solar eclipse thing is just a hologram projected on the dome by NASA  ???
« Last Edit: August 23, 2017, 05:14:14 PM by geckothegeek »

geckothegeek

Re: Are there any FE who think it's NOT the moon causing the eclipse?
« Reply #17 on: August 23, 2017, 05:22:57 PM »
I have a related question about the motion of the moon in the FE model.

I understand that this diagram is a simplification to show how the Sun works and is not intended to show the movement of the moon.


In this wiki article,  https://wiki.tfes.org/The_Phases_of_the_Moon
it is explained that the Sun and moon wobble up and down to produce the moon phasing.

Additionally, the moon can't be on the opposite side from the Sun all the time, because then a solar eclipse could never happen like we saw yesterday.

Is there a more detailed explanation, diagram, or animation that shows how the moon is actually proposed to move in the FE model?

I think you know the answer to that question.  FE claims there is no real FE map, and that diagrams in the Wiki are just examples.  What I wonder is how is the Wiki the end all when people say to read it, but when you quote it you are told that it's only for examples.

As you mentioned that animation always shows the moon and sun always separated by 180 degrees and always travelling at the same speed and in the same orbital path.

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Offline Rounder

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Re: Are there any FE who think it's NOT the moon causing the eclipse?
« Reply #18 on: August 25, 2017, 10:50:31 PM »
I don't think that animation is intended to depict the whole year, it is more of a "day in the life" image.  It shows the FE idea of where the sun and moon would be on a particular day (apparently a full moon day near one of the equinoxes, based on the sun's position at or just barely north of the equator).
Proud member of İntikam's "Ignore List"
Ok. You proven you are unworthy to unignored. You proven it was a bad idea to unignore you. and it was for me a disgusting experience...Now you are going to place where you deserved and accustomed.
Quote from: SexWarrior
You accuse {FE} people of malice where incompetence suffice

Re: Are there any FE who think it's NOT the moon causing the eclipse?
« Reply #19 on: August 25, 2017, 11:06:25 PM »
I don't think that animation is intended to depict the whole year, it is more of a "day in the life" image.  It shows the FE idea of where the sun and moon would be on a particular day (apparently a full moon day near one of the equinoxes, based on the sun's position at or just barely north of the equator).

All of that is exactly what I meant when I said, "I understand that this diagram is a simplification".

Dear Flat Earth Society, 
Is there a diagram that is not a simplification?
Sincerely,
JHelzer
The hallmark of true science is repeatability to the point of accurate prediction.