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Offline markjo

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Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #300 on: June 22, 2014, 05:34:07 AM »
Umm... You do realize that the solar roadway is essentially built on top of a concrete roadway, don't you?
Sigh. And how does that matter? Concrete as the road surface is the problem, concrete as a foundation for a different road surface is not a problem.
Because concrete roadways (even if they're only used as a foundation) are a lot of time and money to install and maintain.  Even with drainage, concrete foundations are subject to damage from thermal expansion/contraction cycles, among other things.
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Offline rooster

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Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #301 on: June 22, 2014, 06:01:48 AM »
Well something has to be a foundation and that something will need repair like all things. I'm not sure what your point is.

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Offline Pete Svarrior

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Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #302 on: June 22, 2014, 09:15:43 AM »
Sigh. And how does that matter? Concrete as the road surface is the problem, concrete as a foundation for a different road surface is not a problem.
Slow down. Take a deep breath. Look at your own claims. They clash with each other.

Disadvantages of Concrete Roadways
Paving cost: The paving cost of the concrete road is little higher compared to asphalt paving.
This disadvantage remains regardless of whether you put glass and solar panels on top of the concrete or not.

Maintenance Problem: In case the concrete road breaks, the whole concrete slab needs to be replaced.
This disadvantage remains regardless of whether you put glass and solar panels on top of the concrete or not.

Safety features: In rainy and the winter season vehicles tend to slip or slide on concrete road due to rain and snow. (Well that's kind of a deal breaker right there)
This is the only disadvantage you get rid of by putting glass on the surface, but having been driven around in a car on concrete roads on numerous occasions I can assure you it's not a dealbreaker. Wet glass, on the other hand...
« Last Edit: June 22, 2014, 09:17:38 AM by pizaaplanet »
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Offline markjo

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Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #303 on: June 22, 2014, 01:41:12 PM »
Maintenance Problem: In case the concrete road breaks, the whole concrete slab needs to be replaced.
This is not quite true.  Concrete can be patched (usually with asphalt) or by cutting out and replacing chunks of the damaged slab.

However, my main point remains.  As Pizza pointed out, very few, if any, of the disadvantages of concrete roadways go away just because you put textured glass tiles on top of them.  If anything, you're just adding more layers of complexity and maintenance (the tiles, the wiring, networking, etc.).

Speaking networked tiles, how long do you figure before some idiot hacks into the road network and starts messing with the LED signage?
Abandon hope all ye who press enter here.

Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.

Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge. -- Charles Darwin

If you can't demonstrate it, then you shouldn't believe it.

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Offline rooster

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Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #304 on: June 22, 2014, 03:13:04 PM »
Where do they even say they are definitely using concrete? I still don't care for concrete, I would rather they use anything else just because it is a hassle to fix. The glass has more friction than concrete so being wet shouldn't be a problem. And yes Markjo, I know they can be super cheap and patch it up - it's awful.

The security of the tiles is something they are thinking of but that's a consideration for every single electronic. I don't think it diminishes its value just as I don't think a possible hacker diminishes the value of a credit account.

Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #305 on: June 22, 2014, 04:50:44 PM »
Where do they even say they are definitely using concrete?

From memory they don't. They're using the now legendary crushed glass from the wheelbarrow to make some kind of "recycled" underlay.

But this, like many things about this project, is just speculation.

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Offline Lord Dave

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Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #306 on: June 22, 2014, 05:10:45 PM »
Where do they even say they are definitely using concrete? I still don't care for concrete, I would rather they use anything else just because it is a hassle to fix. The glass has more friction than concrete so being wet shouldn't be a problem. And yes Markjo, I know they can be super cheap and patch it up - it's awful.

The security of the tiles is something they are thinking of but that's a consideration for every single electronic. I don't think it diminishes its value just as I don't think a possible hacker diminishes the value of a credit account.
I think that's what they used in their parking lot.  They had to.  They need a strong base to hold the tiles in place while also providing a purely flat surface to put the tiles on.
If you are going to DebOOonK an expert then you have to at least provide a source with credentials of equal or greater relevance. Even then, it merely shows that some experts disagree with each other.

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Offline markjo

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Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #307 on: June 22, 2014, 08:56:39 PM »
Where do they even say they are definitely using concrete?
What else are they going to use?  Asphalt?
Abandon hope all ye who press enter here.

Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.

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Offline rooster

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Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #308 on: June 22, 2014, 09:30:22 PM »
I guess it doesn't really matter. Concrete is used for foundation work, I just wonder how quickly it will wear and tear being underneath just panels. Either way, something's gotta be there and it will ultimately need repair as well just hopefully not as quickly as if it were the actual road surface.

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Offline Pete Svarrior

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Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #309 on: June 22, 2014, 10:16:04 PM »
I just wonder how quickly it will wear and tear being underneath just panels.
And trucks. Those are kinda important in the whole shebang.
Read the FAQ before asking your question - chances are we already addressed it.
Follow the Flat Earth Society on Twitter and Facebook!

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Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #310 on: June 23, 2014, 08:16:53 PM »
Even with drainage...

Yeah. Flooding and humidity will play merry hell with all those lovely circuit boards. They can waterproof them, but essentially they become unreusable. Waterproofing is also a significant cost addition. Edit: And they're more prone to overheating once waterproofed.

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Offline rooster

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Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #311 on: June 23, 2014, 08:25:03 PM »
It depends on the drainage system. It is possible to set it up in a way that the water never has to touch the circuits.

Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #312 on: June 23, 2014, 08:35:10 PM »
It depends on the drainage system. It is possible to set it up in a way that the water never has to touch the circuits.

But this is just speculation right? They haven't built a solar roadway and flooded it and proven that water can never touch the electronics.

I'm no highways engineer, but I'll guess that roads don't flood because the immediate drainage failed, they flood because drainage further down the pipe failed, ie got blocked with twigs and detritus. I don't know how anyone can guarantee that such drainage systems will always be clear or that flood water will never touch the electronics (other than coating the cirtuit).

There's just so much speculation, and these are things that are fundamental cripplers to the project.

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Offline Lord Dave

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Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #313 on: June 23, 2014, 09:39:57 PM »
I would like to make a note.

I was dropping my wife off at the train station and noticed the bumpy, yellow line by the edge of the platform.  It's designed to not only give you a good grip when leaving the train but also to make it easier for blind people to know where the line is.  (it's pretty thick)

And it reminded me of the solar roadways panels.  All bumpy and such. Except it's made of concrete.

So, concrete bumps.  Now, concrete is harder and stronger than glass.  Yet many of the bumps had been broken off.  This is due to cargo and foot traffic ONLY. 

And these aren't 50 years old, they're at most 10.  So it got me thinking: If concrete can't handle feet and cargo (like luggage) then how can glass handle cars and trucks?
If you are going to DebOOonK an expert then you have to at least provide a source with credentials of equal or greater relevance. Even then, it merely shows that some experts disagree with each other.

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Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #314 on: June 23, 2014, 11:15:25 PM »
Still a terrible idea. Just accept it.

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Offline rooster

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Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #315 on: June 24, 2014, 12:07:12 AM »
It depends on the drainage system. It is possible to set it up in a way that the water never has to touch the circuits.

But this is just speculation right? They haven't built a solar roadway and flooded it and proven that water can never touch the electronics.

I'm no highways engineer, but I'll guess that roads don't flood because the immediate drainage failed, they flood because drainage further down the pipe failed, ie got blocked with twigs and detritus. I don't know how anyone can guarantee that such drainage systems will always be clear or that flood water will never touch the electronics (other than coating the cirtuit).

There's just so much speculation, and these are things that are fundamental cripplers to the project.
The drain would be underground in tunnels along the road, there shouldn't be too much detritus clogging it. But yes it is just speculation and plans so far.

Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #316 on: June 24, 2014, 12:08:01 AM »
Now, concrete is harder and stronger than glass.

I don't know that it's the case that concrete is harder and stronger than glass.
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Offline Lord Dave

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Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #317 on: June 24, 2014, 01:16:14 AM »
Now, concrete is harder and stronger than glass.

I don't know that it's the case that concrete is harder and stronger than glass.
Really?

This calls... FOR SCIENCE!

http://www.technologyreview.com/news/512411/your-next-smartphone-screen-may-be-made-of-sapphire/

Oh snap.
If you are going to DebOOonK an expert then you have to at least provide a source with credentials of equal or greater relevance. Even then, it merely shows that some experts disagree with each other.

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Offline markjo

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Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #318 on: June 24, 2014, 02:26:21 AM »
It depends on the drainage system. It is possible to set it up in a way that the water never has to touch the circuits.
Does the word "condensation" mean anything to you?
Abandon hope all ye who press enter here.

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Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge. -- Charles Darwin

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Offline markjo

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Re: Solar Roadways
« Reply #319 on: June 24, 2014, 02:31:37 AM »
Now, concrete is harder and stronger than glass.

I don't know that it's the case that concrete is harder and stronger than glass.
Really?

This calls... FOR SCIENCE!

http://www.technologyreview.com/news/512411/your-next-smartphone-screen-may-be-made-of-sapphire/

Oh snap.
Is it just me, or did you just contradict your own claim?
Abandon hope all ye who press enter here.

Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.

Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge. -- Charles Darwin

If you can't demonstrate it, then you shouldn't believe it.