Re: Convex Earth Documentary
« Reply #40 on: March 21, 2018, 06:45:04 PM »
"of his era" ...

If Tycho Brahe had lived through the modern era, where we've seen 50+ years of orbital space flight, have imagery of the whole Earth every 10 mins through weather satellites, have seen over 20 humans go to the Moon and back .....

Do you think he would bother doing his experiment?

You just answered the question of why the source is old. Astronomers wouldn't study something unless they felt it was a matter of question or contention. Congratulations?

So you don't think those things I quoted are a matter of question or contention, then?

I happen to think that it is a matter of question and contention, but that is not what the educational system teaches. Astronomers like Tycho Brahe studied these things back then because it was an open question. But today Astronomers are taught and told that it has all been resolved. They don't even consider to study or confirm these types of things today.

This is why the Flat Earth Society is the greatest free thinking organization on earth. The movement questions the unquestionable and challenges the unchallenged.
Because in order to posit the Earth is flat, you must first decide that EVERY space agency on the planet is lying about going into space, and EVERY image of the Earth from space is fake. That's not 'free thinking' talk that's conspiracy talk.

You're also incorrect in assuming there are no experiments being done to ascertain the spin of the Earth. At the very least many science museums that discuss the topic will have a Foucault Pendulum on display, and information on it. An experiment anyone can go and observe happening in real time.

Lastly, and I only have the links in a long buried post that I should dig up to corroborate this, these basic tests and experiments ARE still done today. But you won't find them written about in scientific journals, because they're part of the curriculum in earning your degree. You seem to forget that much of this foundational experimentation is done as part of earning a Bachelor's or even Master's degree.

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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: Convex Earth Documentary
« Reply #41 on: March 21, 2018, 06:56:30 PM »
Out of curiosity, why is Brahe the only one that matters? What about Kepler and his experiments? Newton? Einstein?

Kepler didn't even study geocentricity. It was already a "closed matter" by his time. It was a "closed matter" in the times of Newton and Einstein too, which is why none of them thought to study it. The same goes for the shape of the earth. Once things are a "closed matter" in the educational system and in common thought, it is almost impossible to supplant.

Quote from: Frocious
Also, I think it is important for you to honestly answer Pablo's question above.

I answered his question.

Quote from: Curious Squirrel
Because in order to posit the Earth is flat, you must first decide that EVERY space agency on the planet is lying about going into space, and EVERY image of the Earth from space is fake. That's not 'free thinking' talk that's conspiracy talk.

Yes, and there is evidence that the actors are questionable. To blindly trust is incredibly close minded.

Quote
You're also incorrect in assuming there are no experiments being done to ascertain the spin of the Earth. At the very least many science museums that discuss the topic will have a Foucault Pendulum on display, and information on it. An experiment anyone can go and observe happening in real time.

Actually, those Focult Pendulums in museums are just motorized props. The pendulum stops after a short while because of air friction. The next time you visit such a museum look up.

Quote
Lastly, and I only have the links in a long buried post that I should dig up to corroborate this, these basic tests and experiments ARE still done today. But you won't find them written about in scientific journals, because they're part of the curriculum in earning your degree. You seem to forget that much of this foundational experimentation is done as part of earning a Bachelor's or even Master's degree.

Then go find us someone's homework if you believe that, and are having trouble finding studies. You should know by now that "the studies exist... somewhere" doesn't fly around here.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2018, 07:01:06 PM by Tom Bishop »

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Offline xenotolerance

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Re: Convex Earth Documentary
« Reply #42 on: March 21, 2018, 06:59:09 PM »
Plus, astronomy 101 isn't usually a lecture class. It involves making observations and reproducing calculations of old. The whole 'they just accept what they're told and assume past work is done' is misrepresentation. I say it's a lie to call astronomy a closed question, a lie from ignorance.

Re: Convex Earth Documentary
« Reply #43 on: March 21, 2018, 07:35:18 PM »
Quote from: Curious Squirrel
Because in order to posit the Earth is flat, you must first decide that EVERY space agency on the planet is lying about going into space, and EVERY image of the Earth from space is fake. That's not 'free thinking' talk that's conspiracy talk.

Yes, and there is evidence that the actors are questionable. To blindly trust is incredibly close minded.
It is just as close minded to blindly declare every single photo from space is fake. Which you must do in order to even entertain the notion the Earth is flat.

Quote
You're also incorrect in assuming there are no experiments being done to ascertain the spin of the Earth. At the very least many science museums that discuss the topic will have a Foucault Pendulum on display, and information on it. An experiment anyone can go and observe happening in real time.

Actually, those Focult Pendulums in museums are just motorized props. The pendulum stops after a short while because of air friction. The next time you visit such a museum look up.
This was discussed last time this was brought up. It's magnets designed to help sustain it's momentum and have no effect upon it's movements. As I recall last time you simply declared the magnets are doing it and refused to discuss it more. Not wasting my breath on this again.

Quote
Lastly, and I only have the links in a long buried post that I should dig up to corroborate this, these basic tests and experiments ARE still done today. But you won't find them written about in scientific journals, because they're part of the curriculum in earning your degree. You seem to forget that much of this foundational experimentation is done as part of earning a Bachelor's or even Master's degree.

Then go find us someone's homework if you believe that, and are having trouble finding studies. You should know by now that "the studies exist... somewhere" doesn't fly around here.
What studies am I mentioning? Also, as I reference IN that long buried post, collecting said homework is quite difficult if one is not presently enrolled in said classes. Although perhaps I can see if the university I'm working at presently has a class I might be able to secure something from. I'll look into that, but don't wait up for me on this point if someone else has something for this.

Re: Convex Earth Documentary
« Reply #44 on: March 21, 2018, 08:19:05 PM »


Quote from: Frocious
Also, I think it is important for you to honestly answer Pablo's question above.

I answered his question.

Sorry Tom, but I don't think you did. I wanted to know if you accepted the results of Tycho's empirical observations and experiments? And saying they were based on incorrect foundations doesn't cut it - the guy who invented the car didn't invent the wheel, but if the wheel didn't work the car wouldn't either. It's the same with astronomy - it works because it does.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2018, 08:22:46 PM by pablozablo »

Re: Convex Earth Documentary
« Reply #45 on: March 21, 2018, 08:54:33 PM »
https://m.facebook.com/DakilaResearch/?locale2=en_GB

I particularly like the piece on ancient alien technology.

Come now, is the cognitive bias really so strong that you're willing to look past the clear evidence that these guys are BS woo merchants?

Sad.

Re: Convex Earth Documentary
« Reply #46 on: March 21, 2018, 08:56:46 PM »
Or the vessels found in Egyptian pyramids that resonate in such a way as to reorganize the cells in the human body.

Some legit science going on there.

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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: Convex Earth Documentary
« Reply #47 on: March 21, 2018, 09:36:08 PM »
https://m.facebook.com/DakilaResearch/?locale2=en_GB

I particularly like the piece on ancient alien technology.

Come now, is the cognitive bias really so strong that you're willing to look past the clear evidence that these guys are BS woo merchants?

Sad.

I did an alt-f find and the word "alien" doesn't appear on that page anywhere.

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Re: Convex Earth Documentary
« Reply #48 on: March 21, 2018, 10:14:08 PM »
https://m.facebook.com/DakilaResearch/?locale2=en_GB

I particularly like the piece on ancient alien technology.

Come now, is the cognitive bias really so strong that you're willing to look past the clear evidence that these guys are BS woo merchants?

Sad.

I did an alt-f find and the word "alien" doesn't appear on that page anywhere.

Yeah I dunno about the alien thing -- you would certainly have to expand all of the stories to do an accurate search, but I don't care to do it myself. There's definitely some wild stuff going on on their page.

Regardless of any of that, I'm looking forward to their work being peer reviewed.

Re: Convex Earth Documentary
« Reply #49 on: March 21, 2018, 10:22:05 PM »
https://m.facebook.com/DakilaResearch/?locale2=en_GB

I particularly like the piece on ancient alien technology.

Come now, is the cognitive bias really so strong that you're willing to look past the clear evidence that these guys are BS woo merchants?

Sad.

I did an alt-f find and the word "alien" doesn't appear on that page anywhere.

Just follow the link in this thread. It's there if you want to find it.

https://m.facebook.com/DakilaResearch/photos/a.161765254422655.1073741828.161764237756090/167020153897165/?type=3&source=48

But I guess your ok with the ancient Egyptian cell reorganizing technology at least.

I mean this is the kind of content I think FE should be thrown in with, I'm just surprised you'd want FE to be associate with that kind of thing.


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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: Convex Earth Documentary
« Reply #51 on: March 21, 2018, 11:34:08 PM »
I don't see the word "aliens" on either of those pages.

I clicked on the documentary about ancient technologies and found a segment about flutes in Bolivia.

I clicked on the second link and it appears to be a bio of one of the founders, who was inspired to create the institution based on some odd experiences he had as a child where he saw some lights, experienced missing time, and a feeling that he was abducted. He explains that "one of the main goals of Dakila Research is to explain unknown phenomena that are often attributed to ufology".

Do you have something against an organization trying to explain mysterious phenomena that people in Brazil will often attribute to ufology?

Is there something bad about flutes in Bolivia?
« Last Edit: March 21, 2018, 11:45:49 PM by Tom Bishop »

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Offline AATW

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Re: Convex Earth Documentary
« Reply #52 on: March 21, 2018, 11:35:19 PM »
This is why the Flat Earth Society is the greatest free thinking organization on earth. The movement questions the unquestionable and challenges the unchallenged.
Oh please.
You declare the earth being flat an "obvious truth". Your basis for declaring it such is not stated, you seem to think the horizon appearing flat is proof but...well, it isn't.
Open a paint package and make a new image 10000x10000 pixels, zoom out so you can see the whole thing and draw a circle so it fills most of the image. Then zoom in to the image and note how the top is flat for quite a few pixels - when I did it, it was over 100. A big enough curve and a straight line are not distinguishable simply because our visual acuity is only so good. I really shouldn't have to explain this.

Anyway, having arrived at the conclusion of the flat earth being "obvious" you then do basically nothing to test that - I guess if you regard it as obvious then you don't feel the need to. You claim to be all about empirical evidence and yet you do pretty much nothing to collect any - I've suggested some experiments you could do to test your model, you've ignored all of them
And all the evidence which shows you to be incorrect is just ignored, wilfully misunderstood or just flat out denied. This doesn't make you a "free thinker". It's not thinking at all, it's just denial. You can do that about anything, it's easy to prove yourself right about something if you ignore all the evidence showing you to be wrong.
Tom: "Claiming incredulity is a pretty bad argument. Calling it "insane" or "ridiculous" is not a good argument at all."

TFES Wiki Occam's Razor page, by Tom: "What's the simplest explanation; that NASA has successfully designed and invented never before seen rocket technologies from scratch which can accelerate 100 tons of matter to an escape velocity of 7 miles per second"

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Offline Tumeni

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Re: Convex Earth Documentary
« Reply #53 on: March 21, 2018, 11:49:21 PM »
Do you have something against an organization trying to explain mysterious phenomena that people in Brazil will often attribute to ufology?

No, but I do find something odd about an organisation that claims to be a group of scientists, but is very cagey about stating who those scientists are, where they gained their qualifications that made them scientists, what work they've done in the past and where it was done and published, etc etc.

Go to any pukka scientific organisation and this will be readily apparent, but at this one. Zip. Nada. Nought.
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Not Flat. Happy to prove this, if you ask me.
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Nearly all flat earthers agree the earth is not a globe.

Nearly?

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Re: Convex Earth Documentary
« Reply #54 on: March 22, 2018, 02:48:18 AM »
I don't see the word "aliens" on either of those pages.

I clicked on the documentary about ancient technologies and found a segment about flutes in Bolivia.

I clicked on the second link and it appears to be a bio of one of the founders, who was inspired to create the institution based on some odd experiences he had as a child where he saw some lights, experienced missing time, and a feeling that he was abducted. He explains that "one of the main goals of Dakila Research is to explain unknown phenomena that are often attributed to ufology".

Do you have something against an organization trying to explain mysterious phenomena that people in Brazil will often attribute to ufology?

Is there something bad about flutes in Bolivia?

From the ufology link - "In the beginning they were voices, I heard them without knowing where they came from, it started at the age of nine. I also felt the presence of someone next to me, sometimes I saw some figures."

Soooo yeah, the guy that is going to prove there is another continent and that the Earth is convex is probably nothing more than your run of the mill schizo.
I saw a video where a pilot was flying above the sun.
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Re: Convex Earth Documentary
« Reply #55 on: March 22, 2018, 06:45:18 AM »
I don't see the word "aliens" on either of those pages.

I clicked on the documentary about ancient technologies and found a segment about flutes in Bolivia.

I clicked on the second link and it appears to be a bio of one of the founders, who was inspired to create the institution based on some odd experiences he had as a child where he saw some lights, experienced missing time, and a feeling that he was abducted. He explains that "one of the main goals of Dakila Research is to explain unknown phenomena that are often attributed to ufology".

Do you have something against an organization trying to explain mysterious phenomena that people in Brazil will often attribute to ufology?

Is there something bad about flutes in Bolivia?

Oh Tom, that's too funny. OK I admit the direct mentioning of the word aliens is not there. But don't try to cast these guys as rational and scientific (unless you just want to come across like a massive merchant of woo yourself).

From site:

''In the Association of Ufologists and Researchers of Brazil, Dakila Surveys, Alan leads a team of researchers whose aim is to map ancient and modern civilizations, archaeological sites, extraterrestrial interactions, supernatural events.And still researches in the area of ​​physical and mental well-being.''



Not to mention:


- Ancient Bolivian Flute in tune with human brainwaves.
- Ancient Egyptian alabaster jars that resonate a frequency that can 're-organise' human cells.
- The Mycenaean CD-Rom

And of course the ancient astronauts and time travelers:

https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=en&nv=1&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=auto&sp=nmt4&tl=en&u=https://tvch.com.br/%3Fvideos%3Dtecnologias-na-antiguidade-astronautas-na-antiguidade&xid=17259,15700022,15700105,15700124,15700126,15700149,15700168,15700173,15700186,15700201&usg=ALkJrhjkU1VS46HCuKacAE-cYuJfIsBhJw


I can't wait to see what flim flam you come up with to divert attention from all this.

Or you could just admit you didn't research the organization very thoroughly because you were too carried away by your confirmation bias...



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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: Convex Earth Documentary
« Reply #56 on: March 22, 2018, 02:59:44 PM »
None of that sounds much different than what is seen on Ancient Aliens by The History Channel.

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Re: Convex Earth Documentary
« Reply #57 on: March 22, 2018, 03:01:29 PM »
None of that sounds much different than what is seen on Ancient Aliens by The History Channel.

True. I don't think that channel (or the Discovery channel, for that matter) have much credibility these days because of that sort of stuff. I'm not the only one.

But they are giving the people what they want, for better or for worse.

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Offline Tom Bishop

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Re: Convex Earth Documentary
« Reply #58 on: March 22, 2018, 07:33:59 PM »
I don't see the word "aliens" on either of those pages.

I clicked on the documentary about ancient technologies and found a segment about flutes in Bolivia.

I clicked on the second link and it appears to be a bio of one of the founders, who was inspired to create the institution based on some odd experiences he had as a child where he saw some lights, experienced missing time, and a feeling that he was abducted. He explains that "one of the main goals of Dakila Research is to explain unknown phenomena that are often attributed to ufology".

Do you have something against an organization trying to explain mysterious phenomena that people in Brazil will often attribute to ufology?

Is there something bad about flutes in Bolivia?

From the ufology link - "In the beginning they were voices, I heard them without knowing where they came from, it started at the age of nine. I also felt the presence of someone next to me, sometimes I saw some figures."

Soooo yeah, the guy that is going to prove there is another continent and that the Earth is convex is probably nothing more than your run of the mill schizo.

So? The Ancient Aliens guy claims to have seen UFOs. A lot of the UFO authors claim to have personal experience, or know someone with personal experience, in some manner. That makes sense. Why else would they be motivated to study such mysteries?

James Randi, of the James Randi Education Foundation, was a stage magician, and literally tricked and deceived people for a living. His history in the subject is what inspired him to study magic and the paranormal seriously. We generally have trust in his organization to study the truth. Why should we believe James Randi, who has a history of deceiving people, over someone like this guy, who does not have a history of deceiving people, and says that he just wants to explain his experiences?

Offline Frocious

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Re: Convex Earth Documentary
« Reply #59 on: March 22, 2018, 07:36:01 PM »
I don't see the word "aliens" on either of those pages.

I clicked on the documentary about ancient technologies and found a segment about flutes in Bolivia.

I clicked on the second link and it appears to be a bio of one of the founders, who was inspired to create the institution based on some odd experiences he had as a child where he saw some lights, experienced missing time, and a feeling that he was abducted. He explains that "one of the main goals of Dakila Research is to explain unknown phenomena that are often attributed to ufology".

Do you have something against an organization trying to explain mysterious phenomena that people in Brazil will often attribute to ufology?

Is there something bad about flutes in Bolivia?

From the ufology link - "In the beginning they were voices, I heard them without knowing where they came from, it started at the age of nine. I also felt the presence of someone next to me, sometimes I saw some figures."

Soooo yeah, the guy that is going to prove there is another continent and that the Earth is convex is probably nothing more than your run of the mill schizo.

So? The Ancient Aliens guy claims to have seen UFOs. A lot of the UFO authors claim to have personal experience, or know someone with personal experience, in some manner. That makes sense. Why else would they be motivated to study such mysteries?

James Randi, of the James Randi Education Foundation, was a stage magician, and literally tricked and deceived people for a living. His history in the subject is what inspired him to study magic and the paranormal seriously. We generally have trust in his organization to study the truth. Why should we believe James Randi, who has a history of deceiving people, over someone like this guy, who does not have a history of deceiving people, and says that he just wants to explain his experiences?

I suppose it depends on how empirical you would like to be. If you are going to believe someone like the Ancient Aliens guy, James Randi, Tycho Brahe or this collection of Brazilians without seeing what they have seen first-hand, why wouldn't you believe NASA, SpaceX or Albert Einstein?