Offline edby

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Re: Water on Mars
« Reply #60 on: July 28, 2018, 01:45:26 PM »
see ... as in observe or have scientifically documented.
I don't know how you could have interpreted that any differently?
I was trying to find a way to make sense of your statement in a way consistent with your belief that no one has in fact gone into space and experienced weightlessness.

Hope that makes sense.

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Offline Dr David Thork

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Re: Water on Mars
« Reply #61 on: July 28, 2018, 02:25:54 PM »
Ah,

This is FE investigations. I can take any side I like. Being as this thread is about the supposed water on Mars, I can either choose to moan and wail about NASA et al being a bunch of liars (which they are), or I can for the sake of the debate accept the assumption and then debate directly about the actual pros and cons of going to Mars, should is be possible.

Being as a I can moan and wail in the other FE boards, I can have a different kind of conversation if I just swallow the lie and progress the conversation from there ... which I chose to do for the sake of interesting debate. This thread isn't about Earth's shape, its about going to Mars to exploit its resources ... and I have a thing or two to say about that as well.

This new flexibility is why we added this board. You can understand that after several years of discussing earth's shape, its nice to be able to discuss other things not directly related.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2018, 02:27:46 PM by Baby Thork »
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Offline markjo

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Re: Water on Mars
« Reply #62 on: July 28, 2018, 05:14:35 PM »
We already see that lower gravity can cause astronauts to lose calcium in their bones from a short period of time.
How's that? The lower gravity I mean.
I don't make this stuff up. NASA makes this stuff up.
https://www.nasa.gov/audience/foreducators/postsecondary/features/F_Bones_in_Space.html
Since when is NASA a credible source for anything?  ???
Abandon hope all ye who press enter here.

Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.

Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge. -- Charles Darwin

If you can't demonstrate it, then you shouldn't believe it.

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Offline Dr David Thork

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Re: Water on Mars
« Reply #63 on: July 28, 2018, 06:31:37 PM »
We already see that lower gravity can cause astronauts to lose calcium in their bones from a short period of time.
How's that? The lower gravity I mean.
I don't make this stuff up. NASA makes this stuff up.
https://www.nasa.gov/audience/foreducators/postsecondary/features/F_Bones_in_Space.html
Since when is NASA a credible source for anything?  ???

I just answered that in the post above.  ::)
Anyhoo, I have a new policy of adding permanoobs to my blocked list and you are the biggest permanoob of all. Having abused your privileged to reply to me about anything other than earth's shape ... you shall become dead to me ... as Rama Set and some others have recently. Farewell. May your posts continue to be pointless and unnoteworthy so as I miss very little.
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Offline AATW

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Re: Water on Mars
« Reply #64 on: July 29, 2018, 12:16:02 PM »
Ever consider I was always flat earth and that is just feeling out the site?  Called investigation
Given your early posts and the fact I remember you announcing that you were switching sides not because you’d changed your position but because you thought it would be more fun to debate from that side, not really.
Tom: "Claiming incredulity is a pretty bad argument. Calling it "insane" or "ridiculous" is not a good argument at all."

TFES Wiki Occam's Razor page, by Tom: "What's the simplest explanation; that NASA has successfully designed and invented never before seen rocket technologies from scratch which can accelerate 100 tons of matter to an escape velocity of 7 miles per second"

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Offline Pete Svarrior

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Re: Water on Mars
« Reply #65 on: July 29, 2018, 12:38:01 PM »
AATW, you have no business discussing that here. Given the debate club format, Round Eyes is welcome to debate either side as he pleases, so long as he remains sincere in his arguments. Your "outing" of him is nothing but off-topic posting, and I'd like to politely ask you to stop.
Read the FAQ before asking your question - chances are we already addressed it.
Follow the Flat Earth Society on Twitter and Facebook!

If we are not speculating then we must assume

Re: Water on Mars
« Reply #66 on: July 29, 2018, 12:53:40 PM »
Ever consider I was always flat earth and that is just feeling out the site?  Called investigation
Given your early posts and the fact I remember you announcing that you were switching sides not because you’d changed your position but because you thought it would be more fun to debate from that side, not really.

I bet you're fun at parties.  Might want to learn some context on those earlier posts.

I think it makes you upset that I can argue my side and thoroughly defend my side, while you have all the science literature behind your side and struggle to even get your point across.  I think that makes you really upset.  Back to topic hopefully now?
« Last Edit: July 29, 2018, 12:56:16 PM by Round Eyes »
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Offline Dr David Thork

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Re: Water on Mars
« Reply #67 on: July 29, 2018, 12:56:01 PM »
Stop encouraging him.


Back to water on Mars ... and the ultimate question ... should we exploit that resource to inhabit the planet or should we preserve Mars as it is and only use it for scientific purposes ... like Antarctica.
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Re: Water on Mars
« Reply #68 on: July 29, 2018, 01:00:22 PM »
Stop encouraging him.


Back to water on Mars ... and the ultimate question ... should we exploit that resource to inhabit the planet or should we preserve Mars as it is and only use it for scientific purposes ... like Antarctica.

From what I understand they already have the technology to create water from the CO2 in the atmosphere, so not sure why this discovery changes anything really.  The water they found is at the pole, way to far from where they have discussed settlements.  Extracting from a mile deep then transporting over that terrain over long distance isn't feasible.  They have already thrown out the idea of Terra firming mars to establish atmosphere and change the planet.  Yeah, what could go wrong there

The whole thing is a joke on many levels.
Quote from: SiDawg
Planes fall out of the sky all the time

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Offline Dr David Thork

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Re: Water on Mars
« Reply #69 on: July 29, 2018, 01:06:12 PM »
I think one of the major points is that this water would take a lot less energy to extract.

Also I'm not sure how you create H2O from CO2 being as you have a decided lack of hydrogen in CO2.

It could also be an indicator of the first extraterrestrial life ever found. Who knows? They live in a high radiation environment (thin atmosphere to protect them) so maybe they have anti-cancer adaptations ... which we could use back on earth.
« Last Edit: July 29, 2018, 01:09:44 PM by Baby Thork »
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Re: Water on Mars
« Reply #70 on: July 29, 2018, 01:20:02 PM »
I think one of the major points is that this water would take a lot less energy to extract.

Also I'm not sure how you create H2O from CO2 being as you have a decided lack of hydrogen in CO2.

It could also be an indicator of the first extraterrestrial life ever found. Who knows? They live in a high radiation environment (thin atmosphere to protect them) so maybe they have anti-cancer adaptations ... which we could use back on earth.

I think the idea was bringing along hydrogen gas, and wouldn't need much since the hydrogen componet of water is like 10% of its weight, so a little goes a long way, and then you keep /recycle the water that is produced.

Cleaning mars water with all the components is going to take a lot of energy as well.

Regarding life, I've always took issue with the notion that water equals life.  Why on earth (pun intended) does life need to be carbon based elsewhere.  Just because it is here, doesn't matter.
« Last Edit: July 29, 2018, 01:23:00 PM by Round Eyes »
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Offline Dr David Thork

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Re: Water on Mars
« Reply #71 on: July 29, 2018, 01:30:41 PM »
I suspect a better way to take water to mars is to burn oxygen and hydrogen as fuel ... as they already do ... but collect and keep the byproduct which is water. How you would do that when you need to throw the water out the back to get a mass flow rate, I don't know, but solving that problem would likely be the start of a decent terraformer.

Carbon has a very unique properly ... it can be bound with other things to form long chains necessary for amino acids, proteins, oils, sugars ... you can't do that with silicon or iron. Putting iron in a chain does sod all. There is a reason all composites are made of carbon. There is no sulphur-fibre body armour or lightweight tungsten nano tubes. Its got to be carbon ... nothing else can be so diverse and complex in structure. You cant have a sodium based diamond or a tree made out of Boron.
« Last Edit: July 29, 2018, 01:32:37 PM by Baby Thork »
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Offline markjo

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Re: Water on Mars
« Reply #72 on: July 30, 2018, 07:56:03 PM »
They have already thrown out the idea of Terra firming mars to establish atmosphere and change the planet.  Yeah, what could go wrong there
It seems that any plans to terraform Mars are probably moot anyway seeing as there just isn't enough CO2 available to make much difference.
Sorry, Elon. There’s Not Enough CO2 To Terraform Mars
Abandon hope all ye who press enter here.

Science is what happens when preconception meets verification.

Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge. -- Charles Darwin

If you can't demonstrate it, then you shouldn't believe it.

Re: Water on Mars
« Reply #73 on: July 30, 2018, 08:34:00 PM »
They have already thrown out the idea of Terra firming mars to establish atmosphere and change the planet.  Yeah, what could go wrong there
It seems that any plans to terraform Mars are probably moot anyway seeing as there just isn't enough CO2 available to make much difference.
Sorry, Elon. There’s Not Enough CO2 To Terraform Mars

i think the fact it has even been discussed is a non-starter for me.
Quote from: SiDawg
Planes fall out of the sky all the time