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Messages - AATW

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3301
Flat Earth Theory / Re: Another FEW Question...
« on: January 15, 2019, 10:56:21 AM »
I always find it weird how people like Tom can sneer at the concept of gravitons and declare that the mechanism behind gravity is unknown and therefore the whole idea is ridiculous and simultaneously believe in so many FE concepts the mechanisms behind which are "unknown".

3302
Flat Earth Theory / Re: Jupiter
« on: January 15, 2019, 09:30:59 AM »
If you want anyone to believe you that the surface of Jupiter has a spherical shape, then you must explain both the faint young sun paradox and the dating of the comets' tails paradox
Jupiter is observably a sphere.


3303
Flat Earth Community / Re: Why do you believe in the FE?
« on: January 14, 2019, 09:53:17 PM »
Bobby even admits that this is evidence is not consistent with a globe.
He did, but then he got out there and did his own tests, which is more than most people on here do, and was unable to reproduce the result. So now what?

3304
Flat Earth Theory / Re: Seeing the curvature of the Earth directly
« on: January 14, 2019, 09:47:26 PM »
Like, the earth was observed to be flat.  Then we went to space and saw that it's not flat, and instead is actually an oblate spheroid.
We'd actually, as a species, long since worked that out.
But yes, since the late 1940's when we've had rocket technology we have been able to confirm it with observations were there any lingering doubt.
That should have killed the flat earth theories stone dead but in a fit of cognitive dissonance which psychologists could write entire books about they just declared every single photo and video from space from every country fake.

3305
Flat Earth Investigations / Re: Flight Paths
« on: January 14, 2019, 09:41:17 PM »
The articles also explain why they sometimes do that and make it clear that this is very much the exception rather than the rule.
There is a clue in the word "unscheduled".
And the examples in the article are northern hemisphere routes - well, the one I could read were.
None of this in any way casts doubt on the fact that there are non-stop southern hemisphere routes and the YouTube video by Mark Sargent which started this discussion has plenty of comments from people who say they have been on these routes.
So I don't know what point you think you're making.

3306
Flat Earth Investigations / Re: Flight Paths
« on: January 12, 2019, 08:45:12 AM »
Planes make unscheduled stops for fuel on supposed "nonstop" flight all of the time.

I think the key word there is "unscheduled". The first article says that one airline had to do it twice in January and another airline only did it once all year. So it's not something which happens often. It also explains why they sometimes have to do that.

The second article says that "dozens" of flights had to make stops - it doesn't say what percentage that is - but it also explains why and it's clear that this is the exception rather than the rule. You have to subscribe to read the whole thing.
The third article is not accessible from the UK for some legal reason.

I have never been on a non-stop flight which has stopped. Clearly it happens sometimes but the idea that they "do what they like" is ludicrous. The airline industry is highly competitive, any airline that "did what they liked" would quickly go out of business as people would use alternatives.

I'm not clear how you think any of this helps FE theory. Are you trying to cast doubt on the whole airline industry? Are they all "in on it" too?

3307
Flat Earth Investigations / Re: Flight Paths
« on: January 12, 2019, 07:38:00 AM »
Seargant does say that there are a few claimed direct nonstops in the video.
So what is the issue then?
After I wrote the above post I looked at the comments on Sargent’s video and it was full of people saying they’d personally flown the route I found and other similar ones.
Of course those comments were often followed by FE people calling them liars but that’s a lazy argument. You can “prove” anything if you ignore or call lies anything which shows you to be wrong.

3308
Flat Earth Theory / Re: Seeing the curvature of the Earth directly
« on: January 11, 2019, 04:20:59 PM »
The earth is observably flat by default. The possibility of it being a big ball, or whatever you imagine it to be, needs to be proven.
Correct. And it has been proven.
We have photos from space from multiple sources.
It simply doesn’t matter if you scream “they’re fake”. Hundreds of people and have been into space and seen it for themselves. 7 of those people are private citizens who have paid for the privilege. The ISS can be seen from earth. Satellite TV works. GPS works.

You have shown repeatedly that your understanding of physics is extremely limited. Your objections are simply you not understanding things and, worse, you refuse to listen to explanations.

Quote
There is no real evidence for the ball earth.
Only if you continue to not understand the evidence or call the bits you do understand fake. But you could do that about anything.

3309
Flat Earth Investigations / Re: Flight Paths
« on: January 11, 2019, 09:27:24 AM »
Of course Mark Sargent gives and explanation of flight paths for the flat earth and the very accepted map.

Northern Hemisphere:

Distance from London to Las Vegas
Distance is 5236 miles

Direct flight time: 10h 50 minutes
That gives us an average speed of 483.32mph

Santiago to Melbourne
Distance is 7022 miles

Direct flight time is: 14h 45minutes

https://www.skyscanner.net/transport/flights/scla/mela/190315/?adults=1&children=0&adultsv2=1&childrenv2=&infants=0&cabinclass=economy&rtn=0&preferdirects=true&outboundaltsenabled=false&inboundaltsenabled=false&ref=home#details/16137-1903151245--31940-0-13981-1903161730

That gives us an average speed of 476mph

Weird that Mark Sargent spent a whole evening not finding anything and I spent about 15 minutes and found this.
Distances taken from https://www.timeanddate.com , one of the sites Sargent suggests



3310
Flat Earth Theory / Re: Distance from Australia to Argentina dilemma
« on: January 10, 2019, 11:03:56 PM »
first off when I checked the distances on other websites they were different than the OP.
I imagine that if others try to repeat what I did they will get slightly different distances - people might put their “pins” in slightly different places to where I did.
I’d be surprised if they were significantly different distances though and the resulting picture would show the same problem.

When I “solved” the problem I did so by trying the same method with cities that were much closer together. Over shorter distances the discrepancy between a flat earth and a globe is less.

FE’s only explanation can be that the distances on Google Maps are wrong. But Google Maps is used by people every day to get around. As has been noted in this thread, Google have sent cars round much of the world. It has been proven reliable. The idea that their maps are inaccurate is ludicrous.

3311
Flat Earth Community / Re: Why do you believe in the FE?
« on: January 10, 2019, 06:40:35 PM »
That is exactly what you would expect isn't it regardless of whether the Earth is round or flat?  Same thing applies to me but I still acknowledge I live on a spherical Earth.  I also know the reasons why.

It seems to me that you need justification and "reasons" for your position while totallackey just simply needs to look out his window and see that the earth is flat.
Correct, and for thousands of years we have had justification and “reasons”. And since we have had rocket technology we now have definitive proof, were there any lingering doubt.

Sometimes naked eye observations are not enough to distinguish between two possibilities. A flat horizon would be the expected result on either a flat earth or a globe of sufficient size.

It’s notable that you regard a flat horizon as evidence of a flat earth but don’t regard the fact that you observe objects fall to earth as evidence that they actually do. It seems observations are only evidence for you when they match your existing beliefs.

3312
Flat Earth Theory / Re: Moon size and distance
« on: January 10, 2019, 03:23:22 PM »
Sure. But not around the time of the bay of pigs when Pluton did it's Venus radar ranging.

The space race started with them one-upping each other with claims. One side would claim to do one thing, and the other would quickly follow up with the same claim.

That's why the US claimed to put their first satellite into orbit within three months after the USSR claimed to put up Sputnick. The US had been trying to get into orbit since the end of WWII, with one spectacular rocket failure after the next. Yet was able to succeed immediately after Sputnick.

Who knew that the managers just had to tell their rocket scientists to "work harder!" and the right engineering and equations would manifest into existence to be immediately implemented?
It's notable that neither side disputed the claims of the other side.
All you've presented is an argument from incredulity, which isn't really an argument at all.
I've seen a shuttle launch, rocket launches are witnessed all the time. What do you think is really going on when these rockets take off and what is your evidence for that?

3313
Flat Earth Theory / Re: Distance from Australia to Argentina dilemma
« on: January 10, 2019, 11:59:18 AM »
I just used distances given on Google Earth, a product you say you use "daily" and therefore must trust.
I don't know how they calculate distances, but I do know it is used by millions of people every day, including you, so if their data is inaccurate then you'd think that would have been noticed.
If you are now claiming that the distances are inaccurate then what is your basis for that? How they are calculated is irrelevant, what is relevant is whether they are correct.

It should be pretty clear that they did not send a little robot with a measuring wheel to go and measure the distance when you made the online request, nor have they ever done that. Next you should probably consider if anyone has ever done that. If you decide that no one has done that then we must be talking about something theoretical that has to do with how the latitude and longitude numbers are determined.
The distances Google claims between places are only theoretical until someone uses the system to get around. Luckily we have millions of people testing it every day, including you, and building confidence in their data.
It seems you trust Google Maps data enough to use it every day to get you around but you don't trust it when it shows the earth isn't flat.
It's good, confirmation bias, isn't it?  ;)

3314
Flat Earth Investigations / Re: Apparent size of the sun
« on: January 10, 2019, 11:45:57 AM »
What proper filters? Solar filters are just doing the same thing as sun glasses, as mentioned earlier.
All filters simply eliminate some of the light coming through them. A proper solar filter eliminates enough that you can safely view and photograph the sun through it and when doing so you see just the circle of the sun and not any glare around it.
Polarized lenses do remove some glare but I wouldn't recommend looking at the sun through them and they don't reduce all glare:

https://www.everydayhealth.com/vision/myths-about-polarized-glasses/

On the Wiki page in the stills you can clearly see a halo of light around the lights. That is glare. It stops you accurately measuring the size of the lights.

3315
Flat Earth Theory / Re: Distance from Australia to Argentina dilemma
« on: January 10, 2019, 11:26:59 AM »
I just used distances given on Google Earth, a product you say you use "daily" and therefore must trust.
I don't know how they calculate distances, but I do know it is used by millions of people every day, including you, so if their data is inaccurate then you'd think that would have been noticed.
If you are now claiming that the distances are inaccurate then what is your basis for that? How they are calculated is irrelevant, what is relevant is whether they are correct.

3316
Flat Earth Investigations / Re: Apparent size of the sun
« on: January 10, 2019, 11:05:14 AM »
Hardly a coincidence. The article shows that the constant growing effect happens to all intense lights that recede into the distance.
No, the article merely claims it and shows some photos with glare.
What experiments have you done with the appropriate filters to demonstrate the effect?
In other threads you have demanded demonstration. This is your claim. Demonstrate it.

Those photos are evidence and demonstration. The "glare" was tested with two brands of polarized glasses, and remained in tact.
Ah yes. Polarized glasses.
Which, as was explained to you previously, do not prevent glare, they merely reduce it.
You will need to get a proper filter and try again.

3317
Flat Earth Theory / Re: Distance from Australia to Argentina dilemma
« on: January 10, 2019, 11:01:58 AM »
- If all distances and continental positions are unknown, then why proudly post an inaccurate map on your site, if you are a movement founded in opposition to inaccurate maps?

The website presents several possible maps in the maps section. The truth is for you, the interested investigators on this forum, to research.
I have, in the thread in the other section about the FE Map. My research demonstrates that no flat earth map is possible - if the distances on Google Maps are accurate.
You say you use Google Maps daily so you clearly trust it's accuracy. I'm not clear then why I'm unable to map 4 points out on a flat map.
I note there has been no FE response other than lackey throwing in some red herrings about screen resolution and refusing to do any checking on my work or do his own.

3318
Flat Earth Investigations / Re: Apparent size of the sun
« on: January 10, 2019, 10:59:31 AM »
Hardly a coincidence. The article shows that the constant growing effect happens to all intense lights that recede into the distance.
No, the article merely claims it and shows some photos with glare.
What experiments have you done with the appropriate filters to demonstrate the effect?
In other threads you have demanded demonstration. This is your claim. Demonstrate it.

3319
Flat Earth Theory / Re: Moon size and distance
« on: January 10, 2019, 10:49:33 AM »
The distance to the moon has been known for hundreds of years although modern techniques make the measurements more accurate

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_distance_(astronomy)#History_of_measurement

If FE disputes all of this then fine but what is their evidence for their supposed distance? What measurements have they made or experiments have they done?

3320
Flat Earth Investigations / Re: Apparent size of the sun
« on: January 10, 2019, 09:23:24 AM »
Prove that the flare is in the camera lens and that it's not an enlargement in the sky. The article also includes versions of the effect as seen in polarized lenses.

It appears that the article has provided evidence, while you have provided none. A massive failure to persuade or to support your argument on your part.
So your claim is there is some effect which by pure co-incidence makes the sun appear a constant angular size even though its distance from us varies so much that it should appear less than half the size at sunset as it does when overheard? It's weird how selectively you argue, previously I've seen you argue against big "co-incidences" like this.

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