5421

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Ask a Jew anything.

« on: October 14, 2014, 12:24:06 AM »

Yaakov: You liar.  You big, fat, ugly, liar. I can't believe you can come in here and spout such horrible lies as fact.

You claim it's fact that Jews saw God at Mt. Sinai yet your own book says this is a lie. 

The Jews saw only smoke, not God.  They HEARD a voice, but saw nothing. 

For those interested let me paint you a picture:

Moses hears God tell him to go up a mountain.  He "talks" to God who tells him to tell everyone to listen to him because he did all the stuff for them.  So Moses comes back and tells his people who then agree.  So Moses has to go BACK up the mountain to tell God what they said.  At which point God tells them to get nice and clean and holy in 2 days and on the third, he'll talk to them.  Oh and that if anyone climbs the mountain or even touches it, they'll die. 

So on the third day, the mountain is covered in smoke with a big fire at the top (fire causes smoke FYI) and a loud voice proclaims the commandments. So Moses goes BACK up the mountain after this and spends 40 days and 40 nights to "receive" the stone tablets, the written Torah AND the Oral Torah.  So one guy was on a mountain, alone, and after 40 days, he returns with two written works and one oral one.  Why would it take God 40 days to give him this stuff?  It would take 10 seconds, max.  It's FAR more likely that it was Moses who did it.  Especially since he came back, broke the stone tablets, and had to go back for 40 days and nights to get new ones.

It would take 40 days at least to write the Written Torah by hand. The Oral Torah would take at LEAST that long to memorise. Then he would have to do it again!

If this were any other religion, you'd call Moses a con man.  But because you were brainwashed into believing this, you can't accept any evidence contrary.

Moses was the original Wizard of Oz.  So put on your big boy pants and accept the truth.  Stop being a child who accepts dragons because your friends say someone saw one.

I would say it's time for you to put on your big-boy pants and admit that 2 million people at one time don't lie and get away with it. Grow up.

"Chapter 19
19:1 In the third month after the children of Israel were gone forth out of the land of Egypt, the same day came they into the wilderness of Sinai.

19:2 And when they were departed from Rephidim, and were come to the wilderness of Sinai, they encamped in the wilderness; and there Israel encamped before the mount.

19:3 And Moses went up unto God, and the Lord called unto him out of the mountain, saying: 'Thus shalt thou say to the house of Jacob, and tell the children of Israel:

19:4 Ye have seen what I did unto the Egyptians, and how I bore you on eagles' wings, and brought you unto Myself.

19:5 Now therefore, if ye will hearken unto My voice indeed, and keep My covenant, then ye shall be Mine own treasure from among all peoples; for all the earth is Mine;

19:6 and ye shall be unto Me a kingdom of priests, and a holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.'

19:7 And Moses came and called for the elders of the people, and set before them all these words which the Lord commanded him.

19:8 And all the people answered together, and said: 'All that the Lord hath spoken we will do.' And Moses reported the words of the people unto the Lord. 9 And the Lord said unto Moses: 'Lo, I come unto thee in a thick cloud, that the people may hear when I speak with thee, and may also believe thee for ever.' And Moses told the words of the people unto the Lord.

19:10 And the Lord said unto Moses: 'Go unto the people, and sanctify them to-day and to-morrow, and let them wash their garments,

19:11 and be ready against the third day; for the third day the Lord will come down in the sight of all the people upon mount Sinai.

Notice: He will come down in the sight of all the people. All 2 million of them.

19:12 And thou shalt set bounds unto the people round about, saying: Take heed to yourselves, that ye go not up into the mount, or touch the border of it; whosoever toucheth the mount shall be surely put to death;

19:13 no hand shall touch him, but he shall surely be stoned, or shot through; whether it be beast or man, it shall not live; when the ram's horn soundeth long, they shall come up to the mount.'

19:14 And Moses went down from the mount unto the people, and sanctified the people; and they washed their garments.

19:15 And he said unto the people: 'Be ready against the third day; come not near a woman.' 16 And it came to pass on the third day, when it was morning, that there were thunders and lightnings and a thick cloud upon the mount, and the voice of a horn exceeding loud; and all the people that were in the camp trembled.

Notice: Thunder and lightning and a thick cloud on the mount. This implies nowhere else.

19:17 And Moses brought forth the people out of the camp to meet God; and they stood at the nether part of the mount.

19:18 Now mount Sinai was altogether on smoke, because the Lord descended upon it in fire; and the smoke thereof ascended as the smoke of a furnace, and the whole mount quaked greatly.

Notice: the Lord descended in fire on the mountain. What do you want him to do, show up as Derek Jeter?

19:19 And when the voice of the horn waxed louder and louder, Moses spoke, and God answered him by a voice.

Moses speaks, and then God blantantly speaks. Damn!

19:20 And the Lord came down upon mount Sinai, to the top of the mount; and the Lord called Moses to the top of the mount; and Moses went up.

19:21 And the Lord said unto Moses: 'Go down, charge the people, lest they break through unto the Lord to gaze, and many of them perish.

19:22 And let the priests also, that come near to the Lord, sanctify themselves, lest the Lord break forth upon them.'

19:23 And Moses said unto the Lord: 'The people cannot come up to mount Sinai; for thou didst charge us, saying: Set bounds about the mount, and sanctify it.'

19:24 And the Lord said unto him: 'Go, get thee down, and thou shalt come up, thou, and Aaron with thee; but let not the priests and the people break through to come up unto the Lord, lest He break forth upon them.'

19:25 So Moses went down unto the people, and told them.

Chapter 20
20:1 And God spoke all these words, saying:

20:2 I am the Lord thy God, who brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.

20:3 Thou shalt have no other gods before Me.

20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee a graven image, nor any manner of likeness, of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth;

20:5 thou shalt not bow down unto them, nor serve them; for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate Me;

20:6 and showing mercy unto the thousandth generation of them that love Me and keep My commandments.

20:7 Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain; for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that taketh His name in vain.

20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.

20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work;

20:10 but the seventh day is a sabbath unto the Lord thy God, in it thou shalt not do any manner of work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, nor thy man-servant, nor thy maid-servant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates;

20:11 for in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested on the seventh day; wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it. 12 Honour thy father and thy mother, that thy days may be long upon the land which the Lord thy God giveth thee.

20:13 Thou shalt not murder.

20:13 Thou shalt not commit adultery.

20:13 Thou shalt not steal.

20:13 Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour.

20:14 Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house; thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his man-servant, nor his maid-servant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's. 15 And all the people perceived the thunderings, and the lightnings, and the voice of the horn, and the mountain smoking; and when the people saw it, they trembled, and stood afar off.

20:16 And they said unto Moses: 'Speak thou with us, and we will hear; but let not God speak with us, lest we die.'

20:17 And Moses said unto the people: 'Fear not; for God is come to prove you, and that His fear may be before you, that ye sin not.'

20:18 And the people stood afar off; but Moses drew near unto the thick darkness where God was.

One assumes that there was no thick darkness elsewhere.

19 And the Lord said unto Moses: Thus thou shalt say unto the children of Israel: Ye yourselves have seen that I have talked with you from heaven.

20:20 Ye shall not make with Me--gods of silver, or gods of gold, ye shall not make unto you.

20:21 An altar of earth thou shalt make unto Me, and shalt sacrifice thereon thy burnt-offerings, and thy peace-offerings, thy sheep, and thine oxen; in every place where I cause My name to be mentioned I will come unto thee and bless thee.

20:22 And if thou make Me an altar of stone, thou shalt not build it of hewn stones; for if thou lift up thy tool upon it, thou hast profaned it.

20:23 Neither shalt thou go up by steps unto Mine altar, that thy nakedness be not uncovered thereon."

Source: Tanach, Jewish Publication Society. http://www.earlyjewishwritings.com/text/exodus-jps.html

I am astounded at your line of argumentation being so poor. I thought I was actually going to be challenged seriously. Wow. That was seriously weak, friend. When I can give you a kicking that badly in 10 minutes, I am disappointed, really. Better luck next time. If at first you don't succeed...

Of course, you will say that this proves nothing. But, you, like so many, fail to keep the rest of the Torah in context, namely, remembering the people the Lord has stricken down in His wrath. The Wizard of Oz didn't do that, and neither did Moses.  God did that. Try again...

So God is nothing but smoke and loud noise now?
Sorry but I could fake all that with nothing more than time and an assistant.  Using no technology either.

And having to take 40 days to "get" a scroll and two stone tablets seems like a long time for god doesn't it?  He, who can poof such things into your hands in a moment required 40 days and 40 nights and to be alone with one man to do it.  This is what a conman would do.

You also made the assumption that darkness was no where else.  Why would God want darkness instead of light I wonder?

Also, 19:21 clearly states that anyone who looks at The Lord will perish.  So how can you see God and live?  You cant.  So again, no one saw God, they saw smoke, fire (which creates smoke), thunder and lightning.  In fact, one may even think that if Moses knew a storm was coming he timed it perfectly.  And one trumpet and an assistant with a bullhorn would be the Voice of God.

5422

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Ask a Jew anything.

« on: October 13, 2014, 06:22:30 PM »

Yaakov: You liar.  You big, fat, ugly, liar. I can't believe you can come in here and spout such horrible lies as fact.

You claim it's fact that Jews saw God at Mt. Sinai yet your own book says this is a lie. 

The Jews saw only smoke, not God.  They HEARD a voice, but saw nothing. 

For those interested let me paint you a picture:

Moses hears God tell him to go up a mountain.  He "talks" to God who tells him to tell everyone to listen to him because he did all the stuff for them.  So Moses comes back and tells his people who then agree.  So Moses has to go BACK up the mountain to tell God what they said.  At which point God tells them to get nice and clean and holy in 2 days and on the third, he'll talk to them.  Oh and that if anyone climbs the mountain or even touches it, they'll die. 

So on the third day, the mountain is covered in smoke with a big fire at the top (fire causes smoke FYI) and a loud voice proclaims the commandments. So Moses goes BACK up the mountain after this and spends 40 days and 40 nights to "receive" the stone tablets, the written Torah AND the Oral Torah.  So one guy was on a mountain, alone, and after 40 days, he returns with two written works and one oral one.  Why would it take God 40 days to give him this stuff?  It would take 10 seconds, max.  It's FAR more likely that it was Moses who did it.  Especially since he came back, broke the stone tablets, and had to go back for 40 days and nights to get new ones.

If this were any other religion, you'd call Moses a con man.  But because you were brainwashed into believing this, you can't accept any evidence contrary.

Moses was the original Wizard of Oz.  So put on your big boy pants and accept the truth.  Stop being a child who accepts dragons because your friends say someone saw one.

5423

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Ask a Jew anything.

« on: October 12, 2014, 08:43:16 PM »

"Name
Moses' name is given to him by Pharaoh's daughter: "He became her son, and she named him Moshe (Moses)." This name may be either Egyptian or Hebrew. If connected to an Egyptian root, via msy "to be born" and ms, "a son", it forms a wordplay: "he became her son, and she named him Son." There should, however, be a divine element to the name Moses (bearers of the Egyptian name are the "son of" a god, as in Thutmose, "son of Thut"), and his full name may therefore have included the name of one of the Egyptian gods. If the name is from a Hebrew root, then it is connected to the verb "to draw out": "I drew him (masha) out of the water," states Pharaoh's daughter, possibly looking forward to Moses at the well in Midian, or to his role in saving Israel at the Red Sea. Most scholars agree that the name is Egyptian, and that the Hebrew etymology is a later interpretation.[11]" {Wikipedia}.

Therefore I expect his name was Moshe, but derived from the Egyptian, since his foster mother was Egyptian. I seriously doubt she would have called him anything in Hebrew. The fact that the word is also a word in Hebrew (meaning something else, of course), is coincidental, and lucky for us, particularly insofar as that "something else" has something to do with narrative of his birth (being drawn out of the water).

This doesn't prove that he was actually named Moses or Moshe.

Also:

The fact that you can't spell "retard" right speaks volumes. That is precisely the point. I won't speak for the so-called "New Testament". It is not a book I believe in, it is not a part of my Faith, and I consider it as irrelevant to my life as I do the Qur'an or the Bhagavad-Gita.

But, looking at the Jewish Bible alone of 24 Books (the Protestants divide these books differently and come up with 39, but the text is the same), the fact that they were written by so many people, and yet, are as consistent as they are is quite amazing. I estimate that the Hebrew Bible had approximately 25 authors in total. Looking at the text the way Protestants divide it, into 39 individual books (Jews count the Minor Prophets, of which there are 12, as one book, and they count 1 and 2 Kings, and 1 and 2 Samuel, and 1 and 2 Chronicles, and Ezra and Nehemiah, as each being one book), one can see that there is considerable unity in the text. Of course, your modern day so-called "liberal biblical scholars" would say otherwise. Not that that is particularly relevant, given that they can't even get the New Testament right regarding the so-called "Q" source. How could I possibly expect them to get the Divine Word right?

You telling me that there are websites devoted to the inconsistencies of the Bible is about as relevant as informing me that in reality, the Pope is indeed Catholic. I am aware of the websites, and have read quite a few of them. Invariably they are critical of Christianity, rather than Judaism, so they spend most of their time on the New Testament, or on a Christian interpretation of the Hebrew Bible.

Keep in mind, I have read the New Testament twice, which I expect is probably at least once or twice more than you have. I have  read the Hebrew Bible once in full, and the Torah twice, which again, is probably at least once or twice more than you have. And in Shul we go through the entire Torah once a year. So, that should count as well.

My inevitable conclusion to the Hebrew Scriptures is the following: If there is something in it that you do not understand, or that appears inconsistent, this is due to your lack of understanding. I would advise seeking out resources that are reliable, both pro and con, to bring to the matter, and exploring the true meaning of the text, and without taking the verses out of context. In fact, if at all you find verses that make no sense, don't just read those, but rather, read the entire chapter in which they appear, and perhaps the chapter before, and the chapter after. This will give you a background for what the author is trying to say.

But remember, and THIS IS KEY: if you fail to comprehend the text, it is not because of a weakness in the text. It is because your mind is failing to comprehend. There IS an answer. It is your duty to find it. That is the simple answer to that. It really isn't that hard.

Allow me to demonstrate by way of example. The Torah has often been used to display the idea that Moses did not write all of it, or for that matter, any of it. Instead, we are told that the Yahwist Source, the Elowist Source, the Priestly Source, and Deuteronomist Source wrote it (JEPD Sources). These sources later were redacted into one complete volume that we today know as the Pentateauch.

In a word, BULLSHIT. Moses wrote the Torah. Moses led the people out of Egypt. As far as numbers go, that is a debatable question. For an interesting take on that, read the following:  Source: http://www.askelm.com/secrets/sec095.htm

And the following:  Source: http://www.askelm.com/secrets/sec107.htm

Both are Christian sources, but contain much good information.

Anyway, why did Moses refer to God as "YHWH" at one point and as "Elohim" at another point? I don't know, and frankly, I don't care much. It was how he chose to do it, or how God told him to do it. Perhaps it had to do with the nature of God being first God, and later, friend. I am not sure. But both titles are acceptable to God.

And why would Deuteronomy have to be written separately from the other four books? There is absolutely no reason to assume this unless you have an agenda to push. And why would the Priests need to write their stuff separately? Moses WAS a Priest. He was uniquely qualified for writing that material as well as the rest of it. So, what is the major malfunction here?

The rest of the Hebrew Bible has no contradictions that can't be explained. It is your duty to see that they are, rather than questioning the text. So, grow up, put on your big-boy pants, and get to work!

Please stop this.  We're far more intelligent than you seem to assume.  We know, all too well, that you're being delusional if you honestly believe that "My Faith isn't wrong, you're just stupid/ignorant" is a valid argument. 

5424

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Ask a Jew anything.

« on: October 12, 2014, 04:19:29 PM »

QUOTE from Lord Dave: "And what do you base the existence of angels and djinn on?  Is it because your Rabbi said so?  Is it because a 4,000 year old book says so?  Or is it because everyone around you says so?"

And upon what do you base their non-existence on?

The same thing I base the non-existence of Unicorns.  Do YOU believe in Unicorns?  And Dragons?  Maybe the Easter Bunny?  Or what about Santa Clause?  They have stories about them.  Heck, we have tons of pictures AND they're believed by more people than all the Jews in the world.

I base their existence on the experience of many men in Scripture. I base the existence of Djinn on my own personal experience, which I shall not explain to you, except to say that I believe it to be a valid experience of the existence of a Djinn. And, said 4,000 yo book has been around far longer than you or me, and will continue to be around long after we are dust. I have seen no reason to accept the attacks of idiots the like of Richard Dawkins, whose name will be forgotten within a year or two of his death, I expect.

The name of Moses, however, has not been forgotten in 4500 years. So ask me which one I trust more, Moses or Richard Dawkins. I think my point has been made.

Neither have the great Pharos of Egypt, or the Gods of Olympus, or even Norse Gods.  Are they just as real?

Believing in the words of someone who had stuff written about them 4,000 years ago is not very credible as a source.  For all you know, Moses may not even be his real name.

5425

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Ask a Jew anything.

« on: October 12, 2014, 03:27:40 PM »

QUOTE from Vaux: "And Yaakov, what if there are no rodents to observe the tree? Please don't cite angels."

Why can't I cite Angels? The Talmud, and the Qur'an both cite Angels and Djinn. Angels are made of Light, and Djinn are made of Smokeless Fire.  Humans are made of Dust (sometimes translated as Clay).

Your refusal to accept either Djinn or Angels does not speak for their non-existence, but rather, for your own ignorance of their existence. Judaism and Islam acknowledge belief in both. Christianity at least acknowledges belief in Angels and rebellious Angels (Demons), as does Islam. Judaism doesn't accept that idea, hence the lack of belief in Hell. Other religions also cite belief in Angels. Among them are Mormonism, Zoroastrianism, various forms of Hinduism, Yazidis, and other related groups in Iraq and surrounding countries.

The fundamental fact is that a good 90% of the world is theistic. Even the Buddhist world, at least in its Tibetan form, is theistic. To deny the existence of God, to espouse open atheism, is to be a small minority. Although I don't dispute your right to do so, I certainly don't believe that the onus is on me to prove my case. The Ontological Argument has already done that.

I don't accept "Creation Science" any more than Richard Dawkins does. Frankly, I consider it a load of crap. Even assuming I accepted a literal interpretation of Genesis (and I am not so sure that I do), the text never claimed to be a frigging science book. Those who take it as such have their head stuck in their ass, in my own opinion.

But to stop me from mentioning Angels and Djinn just because you yourself do not believe in them is simply absurd. What if a Djinn decided to make its presence known, as they are sometimes known to do?

And what do you base the existence of angels and djinn on?  Is it because your Rabbi said so?  Is it because a 4,000 year old book says so?  Or is it because everyone around you says so?

5426

Suggestions & Concerns / Re: On the notion of FES reunification

« on: October 12, 2014, 12:35:29 AM »

Why does anyone want to merge the old site when it is obvious that the old site is run by people who take days to weeks to respond to email or forum messages?

Because some people haven't moved over so this is a way to get them over while also having one and only one forum for all Flat Earthy needs.

And Steve and PP would run it so I fail to see a downside.

5427

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Time does not exist.

« on: October 11, 2014, 08:15:39 PM »

Rushy's point is right in that one can not measure time without being there.

What I'd argue is that time does not require an observer to alter things.  We know this because we can observe an object at one period of time, have no observation for a while, then observe again and see change.  This indicates that an object does not require an observer to undergo change.  And since change requires time, time must exist.

What does not have to exist is the past or future. 

5428

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Ask a Jew anything.

« on: October 11, 2014, 06:21:35 PM »

You would have to find a very good explanation to prove to me that the creation of the Universe was non-random, and yet non-intelligent. That is one of the dumbest things I think I've ever had the misfortune of every hearing. Not that you are dumb, which you are clearly not, but that the statement you uttered was.

The creation of snowflakes is non-random and non-intelligent.  Just saying.

God COULD appear as a human, or anything else for that matter. However, that would NOT be in line with how God has chosen to reveal himself to the Jewish People for 4500 years. So I suspect that doing so would be very unlikely. Praying to a human or animal is directly forbidden in Judaism. I don't think that God would appear as something to which Jews are forbidden to pray.

Jews can pray to burning bushes?

Foreskin was ordered to be removed as a sign of being part of the Covenant. Why that and not something else, I am uncertain. I don't particularly care, however. It is what it is. The benefits to it outweigh the negatives.

So did Abraham remove his own foreskin?
Also, isn't that kind of Gay?  I mean, how do jewish men identify other jewish men?  Why they have to look at each other's penises right?
And what about women?  Not allowed to be in a Covenant?
And did God confirm this with anyone else other than Abraham?  If someone came upp to you and said "God came to me as a tree shaking without wind and told me to cut my arm to show servitude."  Would you?

God was not an accident, since he has ALWAYS existed, without beginning, and without end.

Replace God with Universe.  Just because the earliest we have is a big bang, doesn't mean that was the start nor does it mean that this is the only universe to have ever existed.

As for determining that something was God if I saw it, I have no frame of reference for doing that, as I have never had the experience. I recommend you read Torah. That might give you some ideas as to how certain people handled the issue.

So basically you believe God exists but God himself couldn't prove it to you.  No wonder he doesn't talk to you.

Also: Every way in the Torah can be faked using modern technology.  Not sure it applies.

5429

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Ask a Jew anything.

« on: October 11, 2014, 02:08:49 PM »

QUOTE: "Since blood tests didn't exist either, any STD would have been one that has easily identifiable symptoms.  And such women with those were loose and not worth marrying.  And as we all know, it was a sin to have sex out of wedlock and all married women are virgins on their wedding day so this, theory doesn't hold water."

Well, for an interesting take on prostitution, read about Judah and Tamar in Gen. 38.

Unless it says that prostitutes are perfectly ok to marry, its irrelevant to the discussion or why God would give you foreskin then say "cut it off" a few thousand years after doing so.  Doesn't make much sense now does it?

I don't anticipate being spoken to by a voice in a burning bush. So the point is irrelevant. And remember, the bush burned but was not consumed. First off, SOMEONE wouldn't convince me. SOMEONE implies a human being. We don't believe that humans can be God. We leave that to the Christians, who believe that Jesus is God.

So anything claiming to be God would have to be non-human or non-animal, presumably non-corporeal.

God can't appear to you as a human, animal, or other physical object?  Wow, your god is pretty limited.  (Appear being not the same as IS.  So Jesus IS a human but God could appear to you looking like an old man who can walk through walls) 

So, how would YOU determine it was God?

I can't.  To determine someone or something is God, I have to first believe that God exists.  I do not. 
You, however, do.  Hence why I'm asking you.  I mean, if Moses accepted a burning bush with a disembodied voice, why can't you?  I'm sure he didn't think he'd see one either.

And yes, it is crazy to believe that the entire universe and all that therein lies is an accident. Again, for further argumentation, read Anselm's Argument of Ontology.

Except God.  He was totally an accident. 

5430

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Ask a Jew anything.

« on: October 10, 2014, 11:25:17 PM »

If someone claimed to be God, what would convince you that it really is God?  Like if you found a burning bush that spoke to you (like Moses) how would you know it's God and not a guy with a speaker in a burning bush?

5431

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Ask a Jew anything.

« on: October 10, 2014, 10:00:54 PM »

I expect other STD's did exist, however, even though HIV/AIDS didn't.

Since blood tests didn't exist either, any STD would have been one that has easily identifiable symptoms.  And such women with those were loose and not worth marrying.  And as we all know, it was a sin to have sex out of wedlock and all married women are virgins on their wedding day so this, theory doesn't hold water.

It does, from what I have been told, desensitize the penis a bit.

It does.

I would suggest that denial of God's existence makes one crazy.

I'm crazy for other reasons.

5432

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Ask a Jew anything.

« on: October 10, 2014, 03:51:37 PM »

Circumcision decreases the penis's sensitivity with regards to sex.  This story was likely created to quell the pleasure of sex at an early age.

AIDS/HIV did not exist (or were not know of) at the time so that's not a reason.

Its also possible that Abraham was a sick bastard who decided to mutilate the penis of his sons out of insanity or mental illness and y'all assumed God said so.

5433

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Pandemic Alert!

« on: October 09, 2014, 03:08:39 AM »

Well now you're being idiots too. You do realize that just about every disease he listed receives more funding than Ebola, right? HIV alone totals at about $5 billion.

http://kff.org/global-health-policy/fact-sheet/u-s-funding-for-global-health-the-presidents-fy-2014-budget-request/

TB is the only lower disease, at $843 million. Christ people, at least look this shit up before suddenly forming an opinion based on Thork.

5 times the money for how many more times the infected?  dead? 

But I see your point and do indeed feel dumb.

5434

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Ask a Jew anything.

« on: October 09, 2014, 01:48:54 AM »

Actually, no. The vast majority of Arabs in Israel are indeed Muslim. They are simply among the civilised of the batch.

Woah, hold on.  You said and have been saying that all Muslims are bad.  Now you're contradicting that?  WTF?

5435

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Pandemic Alert!

« on: October 09, 2014, 01:45:43 AM »

I agree with Thork.  Yes its a terrible disease but far worse things infect with more subtle symptoms.  And its not like we have a flea problem these days.

5436

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Ask a Jew anything.

« on: October 09, 2014, 01:12:34 AM »

So Jews have virtually no land. They are then offered 50% of the pie and the Arabs get upset. The same offer is made again, the Arabs are still upset. The Jews, supported with massive foreign aid (for some retarded reason) win a bunch of wars, benevolently preside over the ghettoization of the native Arabs and then offer the Arabs less than 50%. The Arabs are still upset, so the Jews silently allow apocalyptic zionists to encroach on the ghetto and build a wall around the rest. Is that about right?

Actually, the Jews got NO foreign aid except from other Jews until AFTER the War for Independence. Israel then began receiving aid from the United States which has been steady since. I believe Germany and Britain also help. But I don't think they get much from elsewhere. And given the fact that Arabs don't belong in Greater Israel anyway, the fact that Israel was willing to share is pretty cool to me. I have no sympathy for th bastards. But within the Green Line, 22% the population IS Arab, and they are happy. They vote, serve in the Knesset, serve (voluntarily; they are NOT subject to the draft as Jews are) in the IDF, they serve in on the Supreme Court, and have all the other rights and duties of citizens. And they are happy as such. Ask the avg Arab citizen of Israel if he would rather live elsewhere in the ME. He will think you are high. So don't sit there and lecture me about the big bad Jews. Show me a country in the Middle East that treats its Jews as well as Israel treats its Arab citizens. "Palestinians" are not citizens, but occupied persons. They get what they have been dishing out, and they have to FUCKING LIKE IT! I have no sympathy for them.

By Arabs you mean non-Muslims right?

5437

Suggestions & Concerns / Re: On the notion of FES reunification

« on: October 08, 2014, 04:18:42 PM »

How's this going?  Haven't had an update in over a month.

5438

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Ask a Jew anything.

« on: October 08, 2014, 02:15:24 PM »

Its ok to be anti-Muslim because they have a habit of blowing shit up and taking hostages when they don't like something.

So it's ok to be anti-x if they do things you don't like?  What if they started blowing up say... nazis?  You'd have to still be anti-muslim right?  Because they're blowing shit up and taking hostages when they don't like Nazis?  Or maybe Palistinians?  What if they blew them up and took hostages?  Wouldn't you have to still be anti-muslim?  And what about American Muslims who don't blow shit up and take hostages when they don't like something?  (and most muslims at that)  I'm only guessing but based on what I see in suicide bombings, mortar attacks, and active combat units, I'd wager the total amount of Muslims who blow shit up and take hostages isn't even reaching the millions yet.  Are you anti-muslim because a minority blow shit up and take hostages when they don't like something?

We don't. Neither do the Christians.

Uuuuhhh.....
I'm pretty sure Israel (Jews) have blown up plenty of things they don't like.  Most notably in the Arab world.  Not sure they left hostages though but they do have POWs.  Does that count?


As for the question regarding the Holocaust, I won't deny, sometimes we ARE given a pass because of it, the same way Negroes in the USA are given a pass because of slavery.

Is that fair? Well, it depends what you are being given a pass for. If you are being given a pass for bad behaviour, then no, it is not fair, and I shall acknowledge that some Jews do act like alter kackers and then excuse it on grounds of the victim mentality. My response to that is, "Dude! Grow the fuck up! The Holocaust ended 69 years ago. Quit whining."

What is ok to be given a pass for?

Now, what about the nation of Israel? I only have a few minutes before I have to leave, so let me make this quick. The State of Israel is NOT perfect. One can, and should, be willing to criticise, or listen to constructive criticisms of the various policies of the State of Israel without automatically screaming "anti-Semitism!".

HOWEVER, and this is key, there is a difference between constructive criticism, and criticism for its own sake. To criticise Israel constructively is once thing. To criticise it because it is Israel is something yet again, and that IS anti-Semitism, and needs to be called out as such.

Israel is, facts be known, one of the kindest occupying powers in the history of the world. I challenge anybody to find me an occupying power that would allow the occupied to criticise the leaders of the occupiers, to sue in the occupier's supreme court, to request review of any action the occupying military takes, etc. You will be hard-pressed to find any occupying power in the world other than Israel that permits this.

I challenge anyone to find me a more moral army than Israel's. Israel does everything it can to try to get civilians out of the way, by dropping leaflets, by phone calls, text messages, roof knocking... find me another army that does the same.

Now, is the IDF perfect? NO! When it fucks up, should it be called out? YES! I think every Jew, Israeli and otherwise, would agree. But all told, Israel as a nation, and its army, are a helluva lot more moral than just about any other country you are going to find.

So, do some Jews demand unfair treatment because of the Holocaust? Yes. Is that unfair? Damn straight it is, and they should learn to shut the fuck up, because they make us ALL look bad. But we are NOT all that way. I have to go. I'll be back later today. See you then.

So Israel IS a conquer and occupying nation.  Gotcha.

5439

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Ask a Jew anything.

« on: October 08, 2014, 12:59:28 PM »

LORD DAVE, actually, no, you have no argument. Hence, no need to respond.

Denial won't help you in the long run.

Regarding your proposal on the evolution of the word "anti-Semite", that is also a non-argument, since the word is highly unlikely to ever make such an evolution. Ergo, I am not going to have to worry about it. I already despise "Palestinians", and have never denied it. That, in present day parlance, makes me anti-"Palestinian", and possibly anti-Arab, although I have less of a problem with non-"Palestinian" Arabs.

Lets face it. Even other Arabs despise the "Palestinians". The only reason "Palestinians" have any support at all in the world is because Arabs hate Jews more than they despise the "Palestinians". But if the Jews did not exist, no self-respecting Arab would want anything to do with a "Palestinian", who at the best are classified as half-breeds by other Arabs, given their Canaanite heritage, and at worst are basically considered to be lower than the dust. I'm not trying to be insulting or nasty. I'm just telling it like it is.

Language changes often so its quite likely that the meaning of the word will change.  Hopefully before you die.

Also: why is it OK to be anti-muslim but jot anti-jew? 
And: do you feels Jews are given special treatment because of the holocaust and if so, is that fair?

5440

Philosophy, Religion & Society / Re: Ask a Jew anything.

« on: October 08, 2014, 07:13:46 AM »

Question: why do you call Jew haters anti-semite when Semite refers to more than just Jews and the person who associated anti-semite (incorrectly) to only be about Jew hating was a proto Nazi?  Why not just say "anti-jew" and deny the Nazis of their word?

The rest of what you said wasn't worth a response.

I'm glad you admit the superiority of my argument.  Thanks.

This, however, is a worthwhile question. Whatever I may think of the origin of the word, the fact remains that, in the English language, and in several others, the word "anti-Semite" has come to be accepted as being the appropriate word to describe a person who despises Jews. It doesn't matter that the term is not scientific. Its just like the fact that we still tend to divide the human species into races, even though most of us know that race itself has no meaningful relevance from an anthropological or scientific point of view.

The fact that the term "anti-Semite" refers to a person who hates Jews, even if that person is an Arab, and is therefore a Semite, is not my problem. Welcome to the joys of the language.

QUOTE: "MYTH

“Arabs cannot be anti-Semitic as they are themselves Semites.”

FACT

The term “anti-Semite” was coined in Germany in 1879 by Wilhelm Marr to refer to the anti-Jewish manifestations of the period and to give Jew-hatred a more scientific sounding name.1 “Anti-Semitism” has been accepted and understood to mean hatred of the Jewish people. Dictionaries define the term as: “Theory, action, or practice directed against the Jews” and “Hostility towards Jews as a religious or racial minority group, often accompanied by social, economic and political discrimination.”2

The claim that Arabs as “Semites” cannot possibly be anti-Semitic is a semantic distortion that ignores the reality of Arab discrimination and hostility toward Jews. Arabs, like any other people, can indeed be anti-Semitic.

“The Arab world is the last bastion of unbridled, unashamed, unhidden and unbelievable anti-Semitism. Hitlerian myths get published in the popular press as incontrovertible truths. The Holocaust either gets minimized or denied....How the Arab world will ever come to terms with Israel when Israelis are portrayed as the devil incarnate is hard to figure out.”

— Columnist Richard Cohen3

1Vamberto Morais, A Short History of Anti-Semitism, (NY: W.W Norton and Co., 1976), p. 11; Bernard Lewis, Semites & Anti-Semites, (NY: WW Norton &Co., 1986), p. 81.
2Oxford English Dictionary; Webster’s Third International Dictionary.
3Washington Post, (October 30, 2001)."


Source: http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/myths3/MFtreatment.html#n1

So if anti-semite eventually came to mean the proper term (anyone whose language root is Semite) then will you call yourself anti-semite as you hate Palestinians who are part of this group?