The Flat Earth Society
Flat Earth Discussion Boards => Flat Earth Theory => Topic started by: AATW on April 30, 2018, 09:34:22 AM
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Space tourism is at best in its infancy. Right now only available to the mega-rich. But a handful of people have done it.
There's a list here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_tourism#List_of_flown_space_tourists
Here's an interview with one of them, the only women to have done it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSQlIrVzcRE
So...is she lying? Was she tricked somehow? Is she "in on it" too?
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It is generally accepted that everyone that "has been to space" has been faking. This may be for own benefit mostly. She might not be covering up flat earth, but just following what everybody else said. Do you have evidence where she says earth is round?
I'm creating list of those publicly involved (https://forum.tfes.org/index.php?topic=9475.msg147958#msg147958) in space travel faking. Quite something.
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Do you have evidence where she says earth is round?
She doesn't explicitly say it in that video, but you would think that had she been to space and found that she was looking down at a flat-earth she would have thought that worthy of comment.
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Space tourism is at best in its infancy. Right now only available to the mega-rich. But a handful of people have done it.
There's a list here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_tourism#List_of_flown_space_tourists
Here's an interview with one of them, the only women to have done it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSQlIrVzcRE
So...is she lying? Was she tricked somehow? Is she "in on it" too?
It will only be a few more years before the rich will be going to space on a more regular basis. It will be harder and harder to deny reality when tens if not hundreds of people have been. Every one of them will have videos and pictures on social media.
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It will only be a few more years before the rich will be going to space on a more regular basis. It will be harder and harder to deny reality when tens if not hundreds of people have been. Every one of them will have videos and pictures on social media.
The globe is already an everyday reality for most people, as is space travel. There could be people going back and forth to a Mars colony and there will still be flat Earthers. It's not going away because of proof, because we already have proof.
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It will only be a few more years before the rich will be going to space on a more regular basis. It will be harder and harder to deny reality when tens if not hundreds of people have been. Every one of them will have videos and pictures on social media.
The globe is already an everyday reality for most people, as is space travel. There could be people going back and forth to a Mars colony and there will still be flat Earthers. It's not going away because of proof, because we already have proof.
This brings up a good point.
It was stated elsewhere that there is no NASA conspiracy just a space travel one where they are perpetuating the idea of space travel. It was also stated that employees are not aware that their jobs are meaningless, even though they believe they are doing what they say they are.
If that's the case then where do astronauts ACTUALLY go when rockets are launched? Surely they would know if they were in space or not. If they did know they weren't going to space then what about their families? To my knowledge some of them are "gone" for quite a while. Are they in on it as well?
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It will only be a few more years before the rich will be going to space on a more regular basis. It will be harder and harder to deny reality when tens if not hundreds of people have been. Every one of them will have videos and pictures on social media.
The globe is already an everyday reality for most people, as is space travel. There could be people going back and forth to a Mars colony and there will still be flat Earthers. It's not going away because of proof, because we already have proof.
Very true, it will all be fake! For a good time. look up some 10+ year old threads and compare the arguments. same same
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And how does it explain the Columbia shuttle disaster with bits of the shuttle being spread across the states, as well as rather unique debris?
Was Nasa responsible for killing the astronauts?
And the Challenger explosion? They were seen in the launch pad a few minutes earlier, and then the rather public failure of the launch. Was Nasa involved in the murder in order to keep the myth going?
All rather far fetched if i might say so.
If nothing else Occams Razor coming into effect here should well and truly ensure the conspiracy theory is cut. Far too many assumptions with NO FACTS to a conspiracy, other than even more tenuous and completely irrational assumption that the world is flat to then make a whole bunch of other assumptions about a fake space programme.
Really?
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And how does it explain the Columbia shuttle disaster with bits of the shuttle being spread across the states, as well as rather unique debris?
Was Nasa responsible for killing the astronauts?
And the Challenger explosion? They were seen in the launch pad a few minutes earlier, and then the rather public failure of the launch. Was Nasa involved in the murder in order to keep the myth going?
All rather far fetched if i might say so.
If nothing else Occams Razor coming into effect here should well and truly ensure the conspiracy theory is cut. Far too many assumptions with NO FACTS to a conspiracy, other than even more tenuous and completely irrational assumption that the world is flat to then make a whole bunch of other assumptions about a fake space programme.
Really?
I wonder how it works, in practice. Do the space travel sceptics have a dual view of the world, where satellite phones and satellite tv continue to be a part of everyday life, but then switch into another mode when they decide that such things don't exist? Or is there some vast complex edifice of confusion where it all seems to make sense in some absurd way.
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And how does it explain the Columbia shuttle disaster with bits of the shuttle being spread across the states, as well as rather unique debris?
Was Nasa responsible for killing the astronauts?
And the Challenger explosion? They were seen in the launch pad a few minutes earlier, and then the rather public failure of the launch. Was Nasa involved in the murder in order to keep the myth going?
All rather far fetched if i might say so.
If nothing else Occams Razor coming into effect here should well and truly ensure the conspiracy theory is cut. Far too many assumptions with NO FACTS to a conspiracy, other than even more tenuous and completely irrational assumption that the world is flat to then make a whole bunch of other assumptions about a fake space programme.
Really?
There was a thread on here about this and Tom was arguing that the astronauts from the Challenger "disaster" are alive and well and were given new identities...
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For which he can no doubt provide irrefutable proof? Other than EnaG says so?
I am sure the families of those killed would be interested in seeing them rather than thinking they were dead. Or are the families in inn the “conspiracy”
There are far far too many people involved in the conspiracy for the last 60 years for this not to have leaked with irrefutable evidence.
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Sadly ENaG was written some time before the Challenger disaster and Rowbotham was sadly not prescient enough to predict either it or the subsequent cover up. :D
No, he was just invoking some conspiracy shit. Snopes deals with some of this stuff here
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/false-crew-members-of-1986-space-shuttle-challenger-are-still-alive/
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It is generally accepted that everyone that "has been to space" has been faking. This may be for own benefit mostly. She might not be covering up flat earth, but just following what everybody else said. Do you have evidence where she says earth is round?
I'm creating list of those publicly involved (https://forum.tfes.org/index.php?topic=9475.msg147958#msg147958) in space travel faking. Quite something.
Wouldnt that require an extreme level of cooperation between the Americans, Russians and Chinese. Are these, all secretly best buddies even though they appear to be enemies on the world stage? Do you think that Trump is best buddies with Putin. They cant even rig an election without people catching on. Even if they were all best buddies and sleeping together, non of them are competent enough to pull it off except for maybe Putin and even then, Trump would probably screw it up and let the cat out of the bag.
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It is generally accepted that everyone that "has been to space" has been faking.
Not at all. As always, our flattering imitation troll has chosen to misrepresent the FE position.
It is perfectly possible that a handful of individuals made it to something remotely resembling an "orbit". While questionable, it does not inherently collide with FET.
It will only be a few more years before the rich will be going to space on a more regular basis.
We've heard this for literally decades. Aaany moment now, any second now, there will be tourists in space aplenty and that one guy will drag an asteroid into orbit and build a hotel on it (https://edition.cnn.com/style/article/analemma-tower-orbiting-skyscraper-trnd/index.html). Oh yeah, and SpaceX will deliver BFR despite the fact that it's a logistical nightmare for reasons which have nothing to do with space travel. It's happening, guys, so, so soon!
Why don't we just wait until it actually starts happening, if it ever does?
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... our flattering imitation troll has chosen to misrepresent the FE position. It is perfectly possible that a handful of individuals made it to something remotely resembling an "orbit". While questionable ...
What is "questionable" about it?
... it does not inherently collide with FET.
What orbital path would they have followed on your FE (or anyone else's)?
... and SpaceX will deliver BFR despite the fact that it's a logistical nightmare for reasons which have nothing to do with space travel.
Well, they're doing pretty well in delivering regular, re-usable first stages, by successfully landing them, either on land or on barges. They managed to deliver a successful Falcon Heavy test flight, albeit with a hitch on the offshore landing, yielding two out of three successful first stage returns.
What are these "reasons" you mention?
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What is "questionable" about it?
The space travel aspect of it. If you haven't grasped the FE position on this yet, then I won't be able to provide you with much more detail, and you're bound to disagree.
What orbital path would they have followed on your FE (or anyone else's)?
They wouldn't have.
What are these "reasons" you mention?
Here's a good starting point. Note that this has nothing to do with FE vs. RE and is a simple statement of modern logistics, and as such it doesn't belong here aside from a minor quip.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4KR4-TN-Yo
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What orbital path would they have followed on your FE (or anyone else's)?
They wouldn't have.
Where do you think they went, then, such that they believe they were in orbit, but you don't?
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Where do you think they went, then, such that they believe they were in orbit, but you don't?
How would I know? The possibilities are endless and I'm not exactly an insider.
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What is "questionable" about it?
The space travel aspect of it.
Why is space travel "questionable"? What do you believe makes it impossible to go to space with current technology?
And yes I've read the conspiracy page on the wiki. It does not answer this question.
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We've heard this for literally decades. Aaany moment now, any second now, there will be tourists in space aplenty and that one guy will drag an asteroid into orbit and build a hotel on it. Oh yeah, and SpaceX will deliver BFR despite the fact that it's a logistical nightmare for reasons which have nothing to do with space travel. It's happening, guys, so, so soon!
Why don't we just wait until it actually starts happening, if it ever does?
I actually don't think space tourism will become within the grasp of the average person in my lifetime.
I've gone into more detail about this before but there are physical laws which make it tricky. Basically: F=ma
And we don't yet have an efficient enough away to generate enough F to make spaceflight cheap enough for your average Tom.
So yes, some of the excited talk about moon bases and hotels in space were a little optimistic, to say the least.
But the point of this thread was that space tourism is now a thing, yes it's only in the reach of the super-rich right now but it has happened.
So are all those people lying too? Are they all "in on it"?
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I think that the FE'ers will say they're in on it. The top 10% are part of the USA's elite, and I would assume that most likely they will say everyone in America's elite is in on it.
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I think that the FE'ers will say they're in on it. The top 10% are part of the USA's elite, and I would assume that most likely they will say everyone in America's elite is in on it.
I did mention that my neighbour and Tim Peake and his wife Rebecca(the british astronaught) are friends (my neighbour actually out ranks Tim). He showed me the picture taken from the ISS window by Tim. Neither of them are in on the conspiracy so how did Tim spend around 6 months on the ISS in zero g without knowing he was on earth and it was all a charade? No one could have tricked him like that.
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We've heard this for literally decades. Aaany moment now, any second now, there will be tourists in space aplenty and that one guy will drag an asteroid into orbit and build a hotel on it. Oh yeah, and SpaceX will deliver BFR despite the fact that it's a logistical nightmare for reasons which have nothing to do with space travel. It's happening, guys, so, so soon!
Why don't we just wait until it actually starts happening, if it ever does?
I actually don't think space tourism will become within the grasp of the average person in my lifetime.
I've gone into more detail about this before but there are physical laws which make it tricky. Basically: F=ma
And we don't yet have an efficient enough away to generate enough F to make spaceflight cheap enough for your average Tom.
So yes, some of the excited talk about moon bases and hotels in space were a little optimistic, to say the least.
But the point of this thread was that space tourism is now a thing, yes it's only in the reach of the super-rich right now but it has happened.
So are all those people lying too? Are they all "in on it"?
The actual energy needed to bring a person into space is quite small. I believe it's of the order of a few gallons of petrol. However, the problem is that the fuel needs to be carried, and that needs fuel to carry it, which needs fuel to carry it... and most of the weight is the fuel, and the container for the fuel.
If you had an option like, say, a laser from a ground station providing the energy, it might be possible to get around this. But nobody is even working on this approach at present.
The other option is the space elevator, which relies on fairly exotic materials, though such materials have been mooted.
The point being that there's no fundamental principle that space travel needs to be hugely energy/fuel expensive. It certainly will be for the foreseeable future though.
I doubt if space tourism will be something commonly available in the next century. No matter - there's no reasonable way to deny that space travel happens.
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It is perfectly possible that a handful of individuals made it to something remotely resembling an "orbit". While questionable, it does not inherently collide with FET.
That very flattering for anybody involved in conspiracy that they not recognised, but alas.
Your "handful of individuals" actually very large group (https://forum.tfes.org/index.php?topic=9475.msg147958#msg147958) involved in faking space travel.
it does not inherently collide with FET.
As I have said few times before seems many not real FE-ers on this forum. Little surprised you have fallen for this as well now? If we rationalize (dangerous thing) what is publicly being put out there by the billions of dollars, it obviously directly 'attacks' flat earth. We believe is fake (https://wiki.tfes.org/The_Conspiracy)nevertheless, but.
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There are also proposals like the space fountain which do not involve the need for extremely exotic materials like those needed in a space elevator. Basically, massive objects are continually cycled in a loop to transfer the requisite force to support the structure, obviating the need for strong supportive materials.
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There are too many unknowns to give an answer on this subject.
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There are too many unknowns to give an answer on this subject.
Not really adding to the debate is it Tom? Typical evasive answer that does nothing for the discussion.
Is there too many unknowns for what answer?
Do you agree that there is a conspiracy?
Are there are too many unknowns to say if there is a conspiracy, or not a conspiracy? or if space travel is possible, or imppossible? or If there are or not space tourists, or if they are or are not in on said conspiracy?
Surely the Wiki should be updated to reflect that, i.e. this subject is unknown, and cannot be confirmed?
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There are too many unknowns to give an answer on this subject.
Not really adding to the debate is it Tom? Typical evasive answer that does nothing for the discussion.
Is there too many unknowns for what answer?
Do you agree that there is a conspiracy?
Are there are too many unknowns to say if there is a conspiracy, or not a conspiracy? or if space travel is possible, or imppossible? or If there are or not space tourists, or if they are or are not in on said conspiracy?
Surely the Wiki should be updated to reflect that, i.e. this subject is unknown, and cannot be confirmed?
It's the final retreating point when the weight of uncomfortable facts becomes too much. We're now in a situation where the space programme impacts on everybody's life, in a myriad of ways. We have people on Twitter, posting from space. We can meet astronauts, or people who've worked on some part of the space programme. OTOH, we never meet anyone or hear of anyone who has anything to do with the alternative explanations. We never hear from the people setting up the fake rockets, or the fake satellite TV. What we get are proofs that rockets are impossible, like this gem here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jYfwlzWOYCE
Note how many of the comments are supportive of this gibberish. When that's the evidence against, with the massive weight of evidence for, then a believer has no choice but to retreat into "we just don't know".
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There are too many unknowns to give an answer on this subject.
Well, don't you think this is an important thing to research, then?
There's a list of people who have paid to go into space and spend time on the ISS, something you lot don't even believe exists.
It's not a long list because it is still out of the reach, financially, of "ordinary" people but there are still 7 people who have done it.
So either...
1) They are all lying.
2) They have all been tricked somehow
3) They actually have been to the ISS.
If it's 3 then, from your point of view, this is quite a significant discovery. Even if you still want to cling to a flat earth view somehow it would have to significantly change a lot of your beliefs.
You don't think this is worthy of some research - and yes yes, I know you don't have "funding", nor do I but it took me 5 minutes to find some YouTube video of the one lady on the list and find some footage of her in the ISS and discussing her experience.
This is like C. S. Lewis's quote about Christianity:
"Christianity, if false, is of no importance, and if true, of infinite importance. The only thing it cannot be is moderately important"
You seem remarkably blase about something like space tourism which, if true, could completely shatter your world view.
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There are too many unknowns to give an answer on this subject.
Well, don't you think this is an important thing to research, then?
There's a list of people who have paid to go into space and spend time on the ISS, something you lot don't even believe exists.
It's not a long list because it is still out of the reach, financially, of "ordinary" people but there are still 7 people who have done it.
So either...
1) They are all lying.
2) They have all been tricked somehow
3) They actually have been to the ISS.
If it's 3 then, from your point of view, this is quite a significant discovery. Even if you still want to cling to a flat earth view somehow it would have to significantly change a lot of your beliefs.
You don't think this is worthy of some research - and yes yes, I know you don't have "funding", nor do I but it took me 5 minutes to find some YouTube video of the one lady on the list and find some footage of her in the ISS and discussing her experience.
This is like C. S. Lewis's quote about Christianity:
"Christianity, if false, is of no importance, and if true, of infinite importance. The only thing it cannot be is moderately important"
You seem remarkably blase about something like space tourism which, if true, could completely shatter your world view.
The problem being, IF any research was done, and it turned up that it was possible to be on the ISS, then Toms own very beliefs would be shattered, therefore he will not do any research so as to avoid conflicting his own beliefs.
Classic ostrich, head in the sand, if i dont see it, it will go away.
I can understand in a way, it is uncomfortable to challenge ones own beliefs, but real Zetetic, as opposed to fake ones, would be desperate to clear up any confusion.
“Too many unknowns” is a very real incentive to do the research!
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What we get are proofs that rockets are impossible, like this gem here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jYfwlzWOYCE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jYfwlzWOYCE)
Note how many of the comments are supportive of this gibberish. When that's the evidence against, with the massive weight of evidence for, then a believer has no choice but to retreat into "we just don't know".
That was hilarious. "Fans need an atmosphere to work, and rockets thrust off their exhaust, therefore rockets can't produce thrust in a vacuum." Gee, it's almost like they're creating exhaust on the spot!
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It will only be a few more years before the rich will be going to space on a more regular basis.
We've heard this for literally decades. Aaany moment now, any second now, there will be tourists in space aplenty and that one guy will drag an asteroid into orbit and build a hotel on it (https://edition.cnn.com/style/article/analemma-tower-orbiting-skyscraper-trnd/index.html). Oh yeah, and SpaceX will deliver BFR despite the fact that it's a logistical nightmare for reasons which have nothing to do with space travel. It's happening, guys, so, so soon!
Yes, we were supposed to have flying cars too. With all the assholes texting and driving it's a good thing we don't. That said, privatization of space is making huge strides as is the number of people that have big money to throw around. A guy that has a hundred million dollar airplane is not going to think too much about spending a million to go to orbit. Pete, you seem to be the thinker around here and I respect the way you debate. I am curious what your thoughts would be when and if people start coming back with video and pics they took in orbit? Could that convince you?