[EagerAdam]

So I was watching a video on youtube made by a channel called Vsauce about flat earth etc... and it lead me to here.

One point in the video was that flat earthers believe that gravity doesn't exist and instead our "disc earth" is accelerating at 9.8ms^-2.

Now i'm not here to cause a massive fuss and don't want to get bogged down in who believes what, everyone's entitled to their own beliefs. Anyway...

So if the earth has been accelerating at this value for however long it has existed, what velocity do you propose we are traveling at right now? Do you believe it isn't possible to travel faster than the speed of light? If the earths velocity was 0ms, it would reach the speed of light in about a year.

Also if the earth is accelerating upwards at rate of 9.8ms^-2, what is the reason behind the varying value of acceleration due to gravity at different altitudes? More accurately this value is measured to be around 9.81ms^-2 at sea level, but at 10,000ft it's measured to be around 9.79ms^-2. If the earth was accelerating upwards at any given rate, both these values would be the same. T

I haven't done any background research and I'm sure it's been covered already but I did a quick search on here and couldn't find what I was looking for

I'm curious to find out what you think!

[TheTruthIsOnHere]

From what's I've heard, everything is accelerating so there is no frame of reference to determine your speed.

[EagerAdam]

From what's I've heard, everything is accelerating so there is no frame of reference to determine your speed.

As in everything in our universe is accelerating?

Edit: In the same direction*

[EagerAdam]

Also what about the varying value of acceleration at different altitudes?

[TheTruthIsOnHere]

From what's I've heard, everything is accelerating so there is no frame of reference to determine your speed.

As in everything in our universe is accelerating?

Edit: In the same direction*

Apparently.

The common understanding of the heliocentric worldview is that the universe is expanding in an inexplicable exponential speed. We have no natural laws to explain how this could be happening, so it's really no less or more bizarre than this universal acceleration mechanism in terms of uncertainty. What is powering this expansion, or upward acceleration?

[EagerAdam]

From what's I've heard, everything is accelerating so there is no frame of reference to determine your speed.

As in everything in our universe is accelerating?

Edit: In the same direction*

Apparently.

The common understanding of the heliocentric worldview is that the universe is expanding in an inexplicable exponential speed. We have no natural laws to explain how this could be happening, so it's really no less or more bizarre than this universal acceleration mechanism in terms of uncertainty. What is powering this expansion, or upward acceleration?

Many believe it's to do with dark energy I think, but that's a whole other topic and much research is needed into it.

Okay so there is no frame of reference to measure our velocity from, however undoubtably if a body accelerates at a constant rate of 9.8ms^-2 in one direction, it's velocity will be roughly 300,000,000ms^-1 different from what it was a year ago, over the course of just 100 years, that's a change of 30,000,000,000ms^-1 which falls far out of the range of the speed of light.

Edit: Also could I get your thoughts on the varying acceleration of objects at different altitudes, thankyou.

[juner]

Okay so there is no frame of reference to measure our velocity from, however undoubtably if a body accelerates at a constant rate of 9.8ms^-2 in one direction, it's velocity will be roughly 300,000,000ms^-1 different from what it was a year ago, over the course of just 100 years, that's a change of 30,000,000,000ms^-1 which falls far out of the range of the speed of light.

You are using classical mechanics here; you need to be using special relativity. You can constantly accelerate forever and never reach the speed of light. You will asymptotically approach it, but never reach it.

[Boots]

From what's I've heard, everything is accelerating so there is no frame of reference to determine your speed.

As in everything in our universe is accelerating?

Edit: In the same direction*

Apparently.

The common understanding of the heliocentric worldview is that the universe is expanding in an inexplicable exponential speed. We have no natural laws to explain how this could be happening, so it's really no less or more bizarre than this universal acceleration mechanism in terms of uncertainty. What is powering this expansion, or upward acceleration?

Many believe it's to do with dark energy I think, but that's a whole other topic and much research is needed into it.

Okay so there is no frame of reference to measure our velocity from, however undoubtably if a body accelerates at a constant rate of 9.8ms^-2 in one direction, it's velocity will be roughly 300,000,000ms^-1 different from what it was a year ago, over the course of just 100 years, that's a change of 30,000,000,000ms^-1 which falls far out of the range of the speed of light.

The theory of Special Relativity says that we would not reach the speed of light. Instead time would dilate. Here is a post that I thought explained it quite well. You can also look up Special Relativity on Youtube or just google it.

I think the general FET theory is that the varying acceleration rates at different altitudes are caused by gravitational pull by other celestial bodies.

[juner]

The theory of Special Relativity says that we would not reach the speed of light. Instead time would dilate. Here is a post that I thought explained it quite well. You can also look up Special Relativity on Youtube or just google it.

I think the general FET theory is that the varying acceleration rates at different altitudes are caused by gravitational pull by other celestial bodies.

Boots gets it.

[EagerAdam]

In reply to junker:

That is fair enough, newton mechanics don't apply at such velocitys. I haven't covered much in special relativity so I can't say I know much about it, however I do believe the reason objects asymptotically converge to the speed of light is because their mass is believed to shoot up to infinity and due to this mass increase, their acceleration converges towards 0, meaning we wouldn't feel a downward force constantly once we reached this stage and our mass is and forever will be increasing. But then again I don't know for sure.

[EagerAdam]

The theory of Special Relativity says that we would not reach the speed of light. Instead time would dilate. Here is a post that I thought explained it quite well. You can also look up Special Relativity on Youtube or just google it.

I think the general FET theory is that the varying acceleration rates at different altitudes are caused by gravitational pull by other celestial bodies.

Boots gets it.

In reply to boots:

I gave the post a scan as well as google, it seems very complicated! I'll be sure to read about special relativity more to gain a better understanding.

In response to the varying acceleration rates: If these changes are caused by the gravitational pull of other celestial bodies, does that mean flat earthers believe gravity as a concept is an actual thing?

[EagerAdam]

From what's I've heard, everything is accelerating so there is no frame of reference to determine your speed.

As in everything in our universe is accelerating?

Edit: In the same direction*

Apparently.

The common understanding of the heliocentric worldview is that the universe is expanding in an inexplicable exponential speed. We have no natural laws to explain how this could be happening, so it's really no less or more bizarre than this universal acceleration mechanism in terms of uncertainty. What is powering this expansion, or upward acceleration?

Many believe it's to do with dark energy I think, but that's a whole other topic and much research is needed into it.

Okay so there is no frame of reference to measure our velocity from, however undoubtably if a body accelerates at a constant rate of 9.8ms^-2 in one direction, it's velocity will be roughly 300,000,000ms^-1 different from what it was a year ago, over the course of just 100 years, that's a change of 30,000,000,000ms^-1 which falls far out of the range of the speed of light.

The theory of Special Relativity says that we would not reach the speed of light. Instead time would dilate. Here is a post that I thought explained it quite well. You can also look up Special Relativity on Youtube or just google it.

I think the general FET theory is that the varying acceleration rates at different altitudes are caused by gravitational pull by other celestial bodies.

I would love to hear about what general concepts (if any) flat earthers have about gravity, please get back to us on this!

[Boots]

The theory of Special Relativity says that we would not reach the speed of light. Instead time would dilate. Here is a post that I thought explained it quite well. You can also look up Special Relativity on Youtube or just google it.

I think the general FET theory is that the varying acceleration rates at different altitudes are caused by gravitational pull by other celestial bodies.

Boots gets it.

In reply to boots:

I gave the post a scan as well as google, it seems very complicated! I'll be sure to read about special relativity more to gain a better understanding.

In response to the varying acceleration rates: If these changes are caused by the gravitational pull of other celestial bodies, does that mean flat earthers believe gravity as a concept is an actual thing?

Newton's Universal Law of gravitation is rejected by most in the FES. What is commonly referred to as gravity on earth is attributed to UA as has been discussed. However, it is accepted by many that gravitation does exist in other celestial bodies. I don't know much more about it than that.

Here is a link to a wiki page about this topic.

[rabinoz]

From what's I've heard, everything is accelerating so there is no frame of reference to determine your speed.

And no known source of the massive energy needed to cause that acceleration, but heck who cares about practical details like that?

[TotesNotReptilian]

In reply to junker:

That is fair enough, newton mechanics don't apply at such velocitys. I haven't covered much in special relativity so I can't say I know much about it, however I do believe the reason objects asymptotically converge to the speed of light is because their mass is believed to shoot up to infinity and due to this mass increase, their acceleration converges towards 0, meaning we wouldn't feel a downward force constantly once we reached this stage and our mass is and forever will be increasing. But then again I don't know for sure.

You are assuming a constant force is being applied from an outside reference frame, which isn't necessarily true. You can indeed accelerate at a constant rate and never reach the speed of light.

The simple explanation is that velocities aren't additive.

2 m/s  + 2 m/s =/= 4 m/s

[EagerAdam]

The theory of Special Relativity says that we would not reach the speed of light. Instead time would dilate. Here is a post that I thought explained it quite well. You can also look up Special Relativity on Youtube or just google it.

I think the general FET theory is that the varying acceleration rates at different altitudes are caused by gravitational pull by other celestial bodies.

Boots gets it.

In reply to boots:

I gave the post a scan as well as google, it seems very complicated! I'll be sure to read about special relativity more to gain a better understanding.

In response to the varying acceleration rates: If these changes are caused by the gravitational pull of other celestial bodies, does that mean flat earthers believe gravity as a concept is an actual thing?

Newton's Universal Law of gravitation is rejected by most in the FES. What is commonly referred to as gravity on earth is attributed to UA as has been discussed. However, it is accepted by many that gravitation does exist in other celestial bodies. I don't know much more about it than that.

Here is a link to a wiki page about this topic.

I'm unsure how gravitation can exist in other celestial bodies but not exist for the earth. What causes this gravitation force?

"Formally stated, Newton's third law is: For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. The statement means that in every interaction, there is a pair of forces acting on the two interacting objects. The size of the forces on the first object equals the size of the force on the second object."

So going back to a previous point I stated, in that a body's accelaration depends on its altitude. (Example 9.81ms^-2 at sea level and 9.79^-2 at 10,000 ft, roughly). If this change was caused by the gravitation force from other celestial bodies -

"I think the general FET theory is that the varying acceleration rates at different altitudes are caused by gravitational pull by other celestial bodies" - Quote, Boots.

- then going back to newtons 3rd law, the force exerted on a body from the gravitation pull of celestial bodies is equal to the gravitation force that the body exerts of the celestial bodies.

So how can a body on earth exert a gravitation force on a celestial body when the general theory of gravity isn't accepted in the FES? Is the force cause by the mass of the object? If so how come the mass of the earth (I'm guessing it's undetermined in the FES) doesn't cause a gravitation force on objects on the earth?

Seperate question, based on some research, i've found out the FES society believe the earth is a vast, infinite plane. Give this, does that mean it's mass is also infinite?

Please get back to us on this!

Long post!

Edit: Spelling correcting

[EagerAdam]

In reply to junker:

That is fair enough, newton mechanics don't apply at such velocitys. I haven't covered much in special relativity so I can't say I know much about it, however I do believe the reason objects asymptotically converge to the speed of light is because their mass is believed to shoot up to infinity and due to this mass increase, their acceleration converges towards 0, meaning we wouldn't feel a downward force constantly once we reached this stage and our mass is and forever will be increasing. But then again I don't know for sure.

You are assuming a constant force is being applied from an outside reference frame, which isn't necessarily true. You can indeed accelerate at a constant rate and never reach the speed of light.

The simple explanation is that velocities aren't additive.

2 m/s  + 2 m/s =/= 4 m/s

Okay that's fair enough, thanks!

[Boots]

I'm unsure how gravitation can exist in other celestial bodies but not exist for the earth. What causes this gravitation force?

"Formally stated, Newton's third law is: For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. The statement means that in every interaction, there is a pair of forces acting on the two interacting objects. The size of the forces on the first object equals the size of the force on the second object."

So going back to a previous point I stated, in that a body's accelaration depends on its altitude. (Example 9.81ms^-2 at sea level and 9.79^-2 at 10,000 ft, roughly). If this change was caused by the gravitation force from other celestial bodies -

"I think the general FET theory is that the varying acceleration rates at different altitudes are caused by gravitational pull by other celestial bodies" - Quote, Boots.

- then going back to newtons 3rd law, the force exerted on a body from the gravitation pull of celestial bodies is equal to the gravitation force that the body exerts of the celestial bodies.

So how can a body on earth exert a gravitation force on a celestial body when the general theory of gravity isn't accepted in the FES? Is the force cause by the mass of the object? If so how come the mass of the earth (I'm guessing it's undetermined in the FES) doesn't cause a gravitation force on objects on the earth?

Seperate question, based on some research, i've found out the FES society believe the earth is a vast, infinite plane. Give this, does that mean it's mass is also infinite?

Please get back to us on this!

Long post!

Edit: Spelling correcting

Now you're just making me think hard. As I stated in my last post I am about at the end of my knowledge on the subject. However, given that Newton's Universal Law of Gravitation is rejected I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest Newton's Third Law is not going to be considered infallible either. As far as I know the FES answer to your question is as follows:

Q:  How is it that the Earth does not have a gravitational pull, but stars and the moon do?

A:  This argument is a non sequitur.  The cause of gravitation is unknown and RE propaganda would have you believe all masses have the same properties.

Regarding the infinite plane theory, it is known as the Davis Model because it was suggested by John Davis. He is active on this forum. I suggest searching for your answer there, or if you can't find it just start a thread about it.

[EagerAdam]

So to sum up, FES believe...

Special Relativity allows us to accelerate infinitely at a rate of 9.8ms^-2 without surpassing the speed of light.

Changes in acceleration for objects at different altitudes is due to the gravitational pull of celestial bodies.

Newtons law of gravity and Newtons 3rd law of motion are both false/inconsistent?

The true source of the gravitation force is unknown, but mass/energy isn't a factor.

Appreciated your time and replies, thanks!

[pbrah]

Actually, if you look at the FAQs on this very website, you will find that the FES believes that the earth is stationary...And that the "gravity" illusion can be attributed to pressure and density formulas and simple mechanics