[knuckle]

Hi all,

If we look at the ball earth model we are told that the earth's circumference is 40,075 km and that the distance between Santiago Chile and Sydney  Australia is 11,339 km --- ignoring date lines and "daylight savings times" etc shouldn’t their local times be closer together?  The distance between them is about 1/4th the circumference of the earth so shouldn't the time difference be about 6 hours rather than the 12 hour difference we see ?

[Rama Set]

On the globe model that circumference is taken at the equator. The sector of a sphere's surface that each time zone represents will necessarily taper to a point as it meets at the equator. As a consequence, as you travel north or south from the equator, the distance between time zone boundaries will decrease.

Does that make sense?

[knuckle]

so high noon ( the sun at the highest point in the sky) from a given point on the globe is effected how?Does this "high noon" actually fall 12 hours later between Sydney and Santiago ?

[Rama Set]

If by high noon, you mean solar noon, the time when the sun is highest above the horizon, then it would be a function of latitude and longitude and would not necessarily correlate with either 12:00h or time zones.

[markjo]

so high noon ( the sun at the highest point in the sky) from a given point on the globe is effected how?Does this "high noon" actually fall 12 hours later between Sydney and Santiago ?

Don't count miles, count degrees of longitude.  One is a constant distance, the other isn't.  I'll let you ponder which is which.

[knuckle]

ok guys lets see if I have this correct Sydney is at 151.2 degrees east and Santiago is at 70.667 degrees west so we add those two together we get roughly 221 degrees or 139 degrees of separation that is about a 9 hour difference still not the 12 hour difference we are led to believe is there -- if my math is off please correct me

[Rama Set]

ok guys lets see if I have this correct Sydney is at 151.2 degrees east and Santiago is at 70.667 degrees west so we add those two together we get roughly 221 degrees or 139 degrees of separation that is about a 9 hour difference still not the 12 hour difference we are led to believe is there -- if my math is off please correct me

So it looks like part of the problem is that you had some basic facts wrong.  The time difference between Sydney and Santiago is actually 14 hours.  When travelling West, from Sydney to Santiago, the separation is, as you said, approximately 221 degrees.  For sydney to be 14 hours ahead, we would expect it to be between 210 and 225 degrees from Santiago (14 hrs x 15 degrees/hr to 15hrs x 15 degrees/hour), which is exactly what we observe.  There appears to be no problem with the RE model in this regard.

[knuckle]

current UTC time Friday March 20 20:25 current local Time Sydney Saturday 07:20:25 --- current Time Santiago Friday 17:25 but both report sunrise at less than an hour apart local time

[markjo]

Don't forget that time zones often do not strictly follow lines of longitude.  If you look at a world time zone map, you'll see some pretty goofy time zones.  Also, keep in mind that some regions (especially in the tropics or near the equator) don't follow daylight saving time.

[knuckle]

forgetting time zones and meridians there is 139 degrees difference in their longitudes  -- if 15 degrees = 1 hour their sunrise or solar noons should be 9 hours apart but they aren't -- they are closer to 12 which suggests that FE with South America and Australia at opposite ends of the disk fits reality more closely.

[Rama Set]

Your nine hour time difference is going west from Santiago to Sydney which means you cross the international date line. the commonly cited time difference which I provided a source for is 14 hours.

[markjo]

forgetting time zones and meridians there is 139 degrees difference in their longitudes  -- if 15 degrees = 1 hour their sunrise or solar noons should be 9 hours apart but they aren't -- they are closer to 12 which suggests that FE with South America and Australia at opposite ends of the disk fits reality more closely.

The problem is that you can't forget time zones, or daylight saving time.  Just because the sun is at its highest, that doesn't mean that the clock says that it's noon.  Also, don't forget that just because the sun is coming up at one end of the time zone, that doesn't mean it's dawn at the other end of that same time zone.