[Tom Bishop]

As the person who runs this forum, let me state for the record that there will never be any revenue raised from it in any form. This forum is and always will remain free of charge, free of advertising and free of any solicitation of financial contribution (direct or indirect) for anyone to use, provided that they post within the rules.

Naturally, Daniel's website (which will remain the host of the Society homepage post-reunification) is under his remit, but I would be very surprised if he is any more amiable to this idea than I am.

I guess that's makes the idea of raising funds for education materials for those poor school children impossible then. I would also suggest removing the thread on this forum soliciting me for t-shirts. It is against these rules.

[xasop]

I guess that's makes the idea of raising funds for education materials for those poor school children impossible then.

It's quite possible; I simply won't allow it to come at the expense of the public's access to discuss those same educational materials in a free and open forum.

I would also suggest removing the thread on this forum soliciting me for t-shirts. It is against these rules.

I'm quite happy for people to promote Flat Earth-related products (commercial or otherwise) on this forum. It's only soliciting contributions to the running of the forum, or placing conditions and/or barriers on the use of the forum that I'm opposing.

To illustrate with an example, creating a thread to say "I'm selling Flat Earth T-shirts" is okay. Having a popup that says "please buy a Flat Earth T-shirt" when somebody tries to register or post isn't.

[Gulliver]

I guess that's makes the idea of raising funds for education materials for those poor school children impossible then.

It's quite possible; I simply won't allow it to come at the expense of the public's access to discuss those same educational materials in a free and open forum.

I would also suggest removing the thread on this forum soliciting me for t-shirts. It is against these rules.

I'm quite happy for people to promote Flat Earth-related products (commercial or otherwise) on this forum. It's only soliciting contributions to the running of the forum, or placing conditions and/or barriers on the use of the forum that I'm opposing.

To illustrate with an example, creating a thread to say "I'm selling Flat Earth T-shirts" is okay. Having a popup that says "please buy a Flat Earth T-shirt" when somebody tries to register or post isn't.

Kudos

[Thork]

Why would we raise funds and give it to children for education materials? We already pay our taxes to people to do that. This is the Flat Earth Society. We should be raising funds to further Flat Earth research.

Because it is a decent thing to do? The world isn't perfect and not all good causes receive the money they need and deserve. Especially as we are now wrapped in austerity across the Western world.

If you think all worthwhile causes get tax money, why doesn't TFES? You are asking for the same thing. You think your cause "flat earth research" is more worthwhile than educational materials for children, for example. I don't think it is.

As the person who runs this forum, let me state for the record that there will never be any revenue raised from it in any form. This forum is and always will remain free of charge, free of advertising and free of any solicitation of financial contribution (direct or indirect) for anyone to use, provided that they post within the rules.

Naturally, Daniel's website (which will remain the host of the Society homepage post-reunification) is under his remit, but I would be very surprised if he is any more amiable to this idea than I am.

Well this is fairly insidious. You are saying "I rule the forum, Daniel rules the website, and you will all adhere to our ideals." This is against everything we stand for on this half of the society. The society is supposed to be run by the community for the community. If we all want banner ads (and we don't), but if we all do and you don't then that is the will of the community.
I understand that we have a mantra of free and open access, but we also are a community and the reason this half of the society was created was because we were sick of tyrants. I'm not disagreeing with you on your principle, but you should not be issuing edicts.


Regarding the 'charity' aspect, I just think we waste a good opportunity to do something worthwhile. We have a globally recognised brand, we could use it for good as well as for our own entertainment. If TFES was a recognised charity, I also think people would have more time for us as we have more of a purpose. Currently we are viewed as a parody site. I think helping others would also help us achieve our aims ... a more vibrant community.

[markjo]

We are already accused of faking research. If we had an actual budget we would get more and better quality research. Isn't that what you have been asking for since you got here?

Tom, do you have so little imagination that you can't think of any free experiments that will help prove the shape of the earth (other than looking out a window)?

Besides, you have the whole funding your research thing backwards.  First comes a detailed proposal with a budget, then comes the funding request.  If you're serious about doing FET research, then I would recommend a KickStarter campaign.

[Tintagel]

How is offering two issues of Smithsonian Magazine with the copy of the new Earth Not a Globe book sleazy or backhanded? That's the least offensive form of advertising I can imagine. We would certainly get more interest than if we were to sell the book outright. We would be basically giving the book away for free, as well as a popular science magazine.

I would be more offended if I went to a Hollow Earth site and they were trying to push their books on me for profit, withholding research about a Hollow Earth unless I pay them money. My idea is a less sleazy way to fund-raise. The research is being given out for free. You want us to withhold research from the public unless we get paid in cash. That's terrible.

A disclaimer can be made that the "Smithsonian Magazine is partnered with the Flat Earth Society to bring you this offer." Anyone with an IQ above room temperature could figure out that money is somehow exchanging hands. It's not really that backhanded.

Of course they can "figure it out."  Saying that  "Smithsonian Magazine is partnered with the Flat Earth Society to bring you this offer" isn't just misleading, it's insulting.  It wouldn't lead to more interest, because most internet users (in my experience) hate that kind of advertising.  That is backhanded, and offensive.  It's an awful form of revenue generation.  Even if it isn't offensive to you, it's offensive to many users, myself included.

[xasop]

Well this is fairly insidious. You are saying "I rule the forum, Daniel rules the website, and you will all adhere to our ideals." This is against everything we stand for on this half of the society. The society is supposed to be run by the community for the community. If we all want banner ads (and we don't), but if we all do and you don't then that is the will of the community.
I understand that we have a mantra of free and open access, but we also are a community and the reason this half of the society was created was because we were sick of tyrants. I'm not disagreeing with you on your principle, but you should not be issuing edicts.

No, that isn't why this forum was created and it isn't how things have ever worked. As much as I'd love to stick around and recount history to you, I have to go pick up my rental car and drive around New Zealand in an hour, and this thread really isn't the place for that anyway. A discussion for another day, perhaps.

[Thork]

Have a nice trip. And stop being a despot!

[Thork]

Was just wondering ...

If we did decide to make money for anything ... and that's still up for debate, would a reseller option on Flat Earth Brewery beer not seem to weird in our shop? IE buy from us, and the order goes straight to them, we get commission.


That seems both logical and not out of place.

I would add, the flat earth society used to sell Rowboham's phosphorus tonic to get funds. This wouldn't be far removed.

[Pete Svarrior]

There is nothing stopping you from setting up your own store to sell stuff of your own choosing. Given your position in the ZC, I imagine you could with legitimacy claim to represent the FES. However, the product sold will not be any site hosted by Parsifal or myself, as this site was always committed to be entirely non-profit.

[Hoppy]

Tom, you idea in the zc section seemed pretty good. If you can get website earthnotaglobe.com or something similar. You run that site and sell shit on there. Have your forum and maybe link to tfes.

I just checked, earthnotaglobe.com is already taken. .org is still open.

[Tom Bishop]

Good idea. We can have a separate site where we host these products geared for fundraising. From time to time perhaps we can convince Daniel to feature some of our things as a tweet or perhaps temporary side panel on the main site.

I don't think the beer is out of place in such an inventory, but I imagine that vendors have a hard time selling beer legally over the internet where IDs cannot be checked. I did own earthnotaglobe.com at one point, where I was hosting the wiki before we had a wiki. I think Daniel owns it now.

[Thork]

I imagine that vendors have a hard time selling beer legally over the internet where IDs cannot be checked.

I'm not sure about draconian US regulation, but in Europe you can just buy beer online if you want.
http://www.beerhawk.co.uk/

You make the purchase with a credit card. You need to be 18 to own a credit card, ergo you are old enough to buy beer.

How you do that in the US when you are old enough at 18 to marry, have children, get a mortgage, financially ruin yourself but yet not enjoy a delicious beer on a warm summer's evening until you are 21, I'm not sure.

[markjo]

I don't think the beer is out of place in such an inventory, but I imagine that vendors have a hard time selling beer legally over the internet where IDs cannot be checked.

At the very least, I would imagine that you would need a liquor license to sell beer over the internet.

How you do that in the US when you are old enough at 18 to marry, have children, get a mortgage, financially ruin yourself but yet not enjoy a delicious beer on a warm summer's evening until you are 21, I'm not sure.

Because too many 18-20 year old idiots were were killing people in drunk driving accidents.