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Messages - geckothegeek

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1
I found these two quotes in Chapter 11 of Earth, Not a Globe
Quote from: Samuel Birley Rowbotham
"A solar eclipse is the result simply of the moon passing between the sun and the observer on earth."
Quote from: Samuel Birley Rowbotham
As a solar eclipse occurs from the moon passing before the sun, so, from the evidence above collected, it is evident that a lunar eclipse arises from a similar cause...
This chapter is titled CAUSE OF SOLAR AND LUNAR ECLIPSES.  These quotes constitute the only explanation for a solar eclipse.  The entire chapter is actually about lunar eclipses.

I believe the answer to your question is: No to other eclipse causes. FE's believe that the solar eclipse is caused by the moon passing in front of the sun.

Which of course would not be possible with an object only 3000 miles away.

And in the same orbit and the same distance from the earth.

2
Apparently Junker believes these to be accurate depictions of the flat Earth we live on.

Curious, I don't remember claiming that.
Then we must disagree on the meaning of the word 'map' because by the understanding of the word both myself and gecko have put forth that is exactly what you've said.

Just show them.

Already done.
We've been told, repeatedly, on this site that those aren't actual maps.
I assure you they are maps.

I clearly must be missing something. I read everything you quoted and nowhere do any of my statements say what you claim.
So in your world offering forth something when asked for it does not imply any sort of approval or agreement with that something when you don't state so? Huh, you really DO live in your own little world.
Maps were asked for/about.
You said there were maps and offered those up.
You now claim you never said you thought those were maps. O.o
So, as I said, clearly that means we disagree on what the word 'map' means, despite both gecko and myself laying out what we are looking for.

There are no flat earth maps.

Actually, there are.

Just show them. They should be accurate in all respects. I have yet to see them.

Here's what gecko said that you conveniently snipped most of away and replied "Already done." Perhaps you don't understand implication? Or how to be clear in your wording to avoid said implication?

If "they" are "already done", where are "they" ???

I have said it before and I guess I will say it again . LOL.
This website might be more interesting if the theme of the website was :

" Look.....We all now what the shape of the earth is. It is a globe. But have you ever wondered how things would have to be if the earth was not a globe ? This website is for those ideas . The first problem seems to be in coming up with a flat earth map that accurately shows the sizes and shapes of the Continents and the spaces and distances between them."

The only two main maps presented so far (Unipolar and Bipolar Projections of The Globe) certainly don't have those properties. As a start someone or some group needs to do some work.

3
Flat Earth General / Re: How far was it from the Sun to the Moon ?
« on: August 21, 2017, 11:44:29 PM »
Hmm, quite an interesting question. I would guess, based on the information I've gathered over time and on the wiki, somewhere in the range of 1000 miles or less. Moon being ~2500 above us or more and sun being ~3500 above us or less.

I hadn't seen that information. The only thing I have seen is that both are 3000 miles above the earth. Period !
Maybe it's the "wobble" up and down that accounts for the difference ?

4
There are no flat earth maps.

Actually, there are.

Just show them. They should be accurate in all respects. I have yet to see them.

5
Flat Earth General / Re: How far was it from the Sun to the Moon ?
« on: August 21, 2017, 06:53:49 PM »
according to the FErs, during the Aug 21st Eclipse ... How far was it from the Sun to the Moon ? (Sun and Moon being the same size)

If the Moon and the Sun are the same size, the same distance from the earth and in the same orbit , how far was it from the Sun to the Moon ? How do you figure this ?

6
Flat Earth General / Re: Nevermind the Earth, what about the Heavens?
« on: August 21, 2017, 05:31:42 PM »
Why does he have to trust authority? Why can't he know for himself?

Well......"The distance from New York to Paris is unknown."

QFT - Tom also doesn't know why the sun and moon supposedly bob up and down in the sky, he just trusts that they do based on zero evidence.

I think one explanation was that they "wobble" up and down and somehow to manage to not collide with each other. They are both at the same distance from the earth (3000 miles) and the same size (32 miles in diameter.) Unless the moon and the sun don't travel at the same speed on a flat earth , they would be bound to collide at some point in time ?
 But maybe moon and sun do travel at the same speed on a flat earth ? One animated drawing shows them traveling at the same speed and always spaced 180 degrees  apart. It is always sunlight on one side of the earth and moonlight on the other side at the same time.

Observatories have never observed this "wobble."  Oh.....I know. They have observed it, but lied that they haven't....Part of "The Great Round Earth Conspiracy" you know.

7
Flat Earth General / Re: Nevermind the Earth, what about the Heavens?
« on: August 21, 2017, 05:30:29 PM »
Why does he have to trust authority? Why can't he know for himself?

How ?

8
Flat Earth General / Re: Nevermind the Earth, what about the Heavens?
« on: August 21, 2017, 05:24:27 PM »
Why does he have to trust authority? Why can't he know for himself?

Well......"The distance from New York to Paris is unknown."

QFT - Tom also doesn't know why the sun and moon supposedly bob up and down in the sky, he just trusts that they do based on zero evidence.

I think one explanation was that they "wobble" up and down and somehow to manage to not collide with each other. They are both at the same distance from the earth (3000 miles) and the same size (32 miles in diameter.) Unless the moon and the sun don't travel at the same speed on a flat earth , they would be bound to collide at some point in time ?
 But maybe moon and sun travel at the same speed on a flat earth ? One animated drawing shows them traveling at the same speed and always spaced 180 degrees  apart. It is always sunlight on one side of the earth and moonlight on the other side at the same time.

Observatories have never observed this "wobble."  Oh.....I know. They have observed it, but lied that they haven't....Part of "The Great Round Earth Conspiracy" you know.

9
Flat Earth General / Re: FES Think Tank - Week 1 Poll
« on: August 21, 2017, 05:01:52 PM »
Some time in the future, after the present subject has been discused at length, I would like to see a discussion of the horizon, the distance to the horizon, and the methods and formulas for estimating the distance on a flat earth.

This could be put on the shelf for consideration at some later time.

Just from observation and facts concerning this subject, this seems to be one of the greatest  of fallacies in flat earth ideas.

10
Flat Earth General / Re: Nevermind the Earth, what about the Heavens?
« on: August 21, 2017, 01:32:18 AM »
Why does he have to trust authority? Why can't he know for himself?

Well......"The distance from New York to Paris is unknown."

11
Flat Earth General / Re: Nevermind the Earth, what about the Heavens?
« on: August 21, 2017, 12:52:02 AM »
It is very simple. You just have to trust persons who are experts in their fields, such as those at the astronomical observatories to give you the answers. You just have to trust your instructors. If you don't know little or anything about anything you have to do some study to learn about it. Most engineers and scientists started out in first grade, too,  like anyone else. They just continued on studying and learning farther than other persons.
There you go, trust authority, trust your teachers, professors, doctors, government, the pope, the media, Coca Cola, McDonald's, Walmart, Hitler, Stalin and Mao.

I'll trust them enough to listen to what they're saying, but that's it, if I have questions, I'll ask them, and if I spot what I think are holes in what they're saying, I'll call them out.
I'm not going to trust their claims without something I can empirically verify.

Most teachers don't verify anything they've been taught, so they actually don't know anything.
Engineers can often use what they've been taught, so I take little issue with that.
That's actually probably the best form of verification, being able to use something.
If you can use it than they must be right about something, althou they may not be verifying everything they're teaching.

The trouble is no one, except for NASA and some other government space agencies can supposedly use 'factoids' like the sun is 149.6 (I love how specific they are about something they've never been to, and can never go to. Not 150 million kilometers, 149.6, how do you like that? Next year they'll say it's actually 149.8, and a few decades from now they'll say it's actually 188.295. Derrr, can we all just agree it's really, fragging far??? But that's just it, maybe it's much, much closer...or further than they think or say they know.) million kilometers away, so you can't verify it that way, by using it to do something the way an engineer does, so how can you verify it?

Maybe this discussion might best be considered closed
But if or if not, a few thoughts.

How many courses  have you taken where you have classroom hours on theory and then more class room hours following in lab proving and verifying the theories ?

Getting back to the subject, are you saying you wouldn't trust anyone at an observatory ?
How much do you know about how they measured those distances ?

12
Flat Earth General / Re: Nevermind the Earth, what about the Heavens?
« on: August 21, 2017, 12:47:51 AM »
It is very simple. You just have to trust persons who are experts in their fields, such as those at the astronomical observatories to give you the answers. You just have to trust your instructors. If you don't know little or anything about anything you have to do some study to learn about it. Most engineers and scientists started out in first grade, too,  like anyone else. They just continued on studying and learning farther than other persons.
There you go, trust authority, trust your teachers, professors, doctors, government, the pope, the media, Coca Cola, McDonald's, Walmart, Hitler, Stalin and Mao.

I'll trust them enough to listen to what they're saying, but that's it, if I have questions, I'll ask them, and if I spot what I think are holes in what they're saying, I'll call them out.
I'm not going to trust their claims without something I can empirically verify.

Most teachers don't verify anything they've been taught, so they actually don't know anything.
Engineers can often use what they've been taught, so I take little issue with that.
That's actually probably the best form of verification, being able to use something.
If you can use it than they must be right about something, althou they may not be verifying everything they're teaching.

The trouble is no one, except for NASA and some other government space agencies can supposedly use 'factoids' like the sun is 149.6 (I love how specific they are about something they've never been to, and can never go to. Not 150 million kilometers, 149.6, how do you like that? Next year they'll say it's actually 149.8, and a few decades from now they'll say it's actually 188.295. Derrr, can we all just agree it's really, fragging far??? But that's just it, maybe it's much, much closer...or further than they think or say they know.) million kilometers away, so you can't verify it that way, by using it to do something the way an engineer does, so how can you verify it?

If that is the way you think, if you will pardon me for saying it, if it is true that you think that way,  you would be a hopeless case if you ever expected to get a job in the real world in any field of science or engineering. Maybe you are in some other occupation where you don't need to know these things.

I could give you an example of my own experiences but I have suspicions you would not believe me.

So.......I think I 'll just give it up as a lost cause ,  bow out and leave it to anyone else who wants to have a go at it with you.
.

13
There is nothing in the Wiki about solar eclipse, as far as I can find.

Did you try searching?
Gee, Tom, thanks so much!  Yes, I tried searching.  That's why the sentence reads "as far as I can FIND" instead of "as far as I KNOW"
For example, I searched for "solar eclipse" and got two results for LUNAR eclipse.
I searched the word "solar" by itself and got 6 results, none of them about solar eclipses.
I searched the word "eclipse" by itself and got a dozen results, again all for LUNAR eclipse results.

Tell you what: if it's in there somewhere, and if you know it's there, you could help a guy out and tell me where it is.

Rounder-
 I tried the same way you did and got the same results....or lack of them.
Make that two persons that need some help.

14
Flat Earth General / Re: The Moon
« on: August 20, 2017, 11:31:33 PM »
Quote: "The distance from New York to Paris is unknown." : End of  quote

15
Flat Earth General / Re: Nevermind the Earth, what about the Heavens?
« on: August 20, 2017, 11:24:57 PM »
It is very simple. You just have to trust persons who are experts in their fields, such as those at the astronomical observatories to give you the answers. Their job is observing these things.

 You just have to trust your instructors. If you don't know little or anything about anything you have to do some study to learn about it. Most engineers and scientists started out in first grade, too,  like anyone else. They just continued on studying and learning farther than other persons.

16
Flat Earth General / Re: Nevermind the Earth, what about the Heavens?
« on: August 20, 2017, 03:51:04 PM »
Everyone to their own beliefs.
I have made this apology before, but I believe that if you had never worked in some job that depended on the earth being round, you might be taken into this flat earth nonsense.
If you want to learn about something, you have to do some study of it.
You have to do that in the real world.

17
Flat Earth General / Re: Nevermind the Earth, what about the Heavens?
« on: August 20, 2017, 02:43:13 PM »
I think the earth is probably round, but I think flat earth theorists have made a better case for flat earth than round earthers are crediting them.
However, I don't wish to get into that here.

Who can prove to me the heavens are what NASA claims they are?
At this point all I have is information, not knowledge.
I've been told what the the sun, moon and stars are.
I've been told what their dimensions are, but I haven't observed anything indicating the sun is a million times bigger than the earth, or millions of miles away.
I've observed nothing indicating the stars are suns, or that they're averagely as big as the sun, just millions of times further away.
Where's the proof?

Forget about NASA if you are one of those suffering from the flat earth NASA Paranoia.
An astronomical observatory is the best place to go for proof.
Another thing I would recommend is taking an observatory tour and a night "Star Party."
There was proof long before NASA came into being.

But be assured that the earth is a globe and not some flat disc with an ice ring, et cetera, et cetera, and so forth.
LOL
 
I won't get into that , too ,   but IMHO flat earth hasn't made a good case, much less a better case.

18
Flat Earth General / Re: The Moon
« on: August 19, 2017, 02:31:25 AM »
The distance to the moon is solidly known. If you have a steady enough aim (Not your hand, some kind of system), a laser, a receiver, and good timing software for it, you can calculate using the speed of light as a known constant and the return time to get the distance. We have done this using the Lunar Rangefinding Receivers, left by the Apollo astronauts.

Amateur radio operators have also calculated the distance to the moon in their "Moon Bounce" experiments, using the speed of radio waves as a constant and the return time to get the distance. They have done this by transmitting radio signals to the moon, "bouncing" them off the moon's surface , and noting when they were received back on the earth.
The results compared with the known distance and it was not 3,000 miles. On one example the distance was calculated to be 238,150 miles.

19
Flat Earth General / Re: The Moon
« on: August 19, 2017, 02:15:40 AM »
Many of the flat earth ideas would be true IF the earth WAS flat.
But the earth IS NOT flat.

20
Flat Earth Q&A / Re: How Big Is The NASA conspiracy?
« on: August 19, 2017, 12:45:51 AM »
OK so what do you think about my cousin then? it sounds like he is just being lied too.

IF you hold with FE beliefs then you'd have to say that right now, he's being lied to - but once he gets more deeply into the subject, there is no possibility that he could not learn "The Truth" - so he'd either have to sign up to the conspiracy - or "come out" as a Flat Earther and give up astronomy, which he'd then know were a pack of lies.

There are a LOT of astronomers in the world...I don't think any of them gave it up when they discovered that they'd be lied to for all this time...so for FE to be tenable, you'd have to believe that 100% of astronomers are intellectually dishonest people who signed up to the conspiracy...and that having done that, not a single one changed their minds and revealed the truth to the world.

That's not just true of the present day - the conspiracy must go back many hundreds of years.

Astronomers aren't liars. They are merely mistaken.

How about those Navy lookouts who can estimate the distance to the horizon ?
Are they merely mistaken ?

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